Thread: Can horn or wood scales be dyed ?

Many of the old W&B black Scales are in tact, but faded out. Can they be dyed ?

Hi Dave,

Pleased to meet you !!....You should contact Maggard Razors – Straight Razor Restoration, Custom Scales and Wet Shaving Products
Brad Maggard (forum name "Undream) in Adrian, Michigan.
He can tell you what you want to know.

My experience in knifemaking and restoration is that depending on the material, wood can be dyed,
and replacement (horn) materials are more than reasonable in terms of cost.
Keep in mind, that handles have been worn down over the years (decades ?) and that their true shape
has been lost.

What specifically is your intended project ?

best Wishes,

Peter

Old horn scales have been extensively dyed since the late 1700s at least. Horn was used to make a faux tortoiseshell - very many vintage razors have scales like this. I have examples of razors from around the 1850s that have had the horn bleached to almost transparent (aka 'blonde'), some which have had this treatment and then been dyed a gaudy red, some pink, some yellow. I have seen but not owned green examples. So yes - it can be done - if they could do it then, it can be done now.

Trouble is some of the old processes used fairly toxic chemicals. Horn mock tortoiseshell had a number of recipes, some of which included quicklime, litharge (lead) and lye, others used red lead and lye. To get black, the horn was first dyed green - using the liquid obtained by dissolving brass in nitric acid, then treating it with a decoction of logwood (a plant of the legume family). Red and green were obtained by first boiling the horn in alum water, then treating it variously with quicklime, ammonia, white wine vinegar, rainwater, brazil-wood, etc. Black was obtained by steeping the horn in silver nitrate (aka 'lunar caustic'). Undiluted it is indeed very caustic (it can remove warts!) but it is to be diluted so that it does not corrode the horn. After a thorough soaking it is taken into sunlight - the UV turns it deep black/brown. Also, anything the lunar caustic has touched will stain - as I know to my cost - fingers, hands, fingernails, furniture, towels, etc. And it takes months to come off your skin.

Other 'black' recipes called for the use of mercury salts and potassium nitrate - even more hazardous than lunar caustic. Some used red lead staining followed by washing in water and vinegar. This (Wagners Method) was a cheaper process, but after time white deposits (lead oxide - white lead) form on the horn. Thy can be polished away, but will always return.

All the processes that call for heat, or using logwood and gall decoctions that are heated make horn very brittle. I have seen red and yellow horn shatter like glass.

Aniline dyes were sometimes used - this type of dyeing does not penetrate very far into the horn, and still calls for the use of hydrochloric and sulphuric acid.

Other processes are simpler and call for the horn to be whitened (or made 'blonde' proper bleaching is a no-no - it is very injurious to the structure of the horn) followed by dyes such as anilines, tinctures, etc, like methyl violet. These are probably the least hazardous among the old recipes.

I suspect that the modern ways of dyeing horn use less hazardous materials.

Regards,
Neil

Thanks guys. I have several Sheffield and Solingen SR with black scales that are really faded out especially around the pins. Just wonder ed if it would be appropriate to dye black before selling them. A couple of yellowish horn scales that way as well. Seems that the yellow horn gets translucent,

If Black is the natural color,Might re-hydrating them with neatsfoot oil bring back the color??

Yes i might, really dry horn gets white.

Certainly worth a try - old horn gets a bit fibrous and 'wooly' in the top layer due to scuffs, abrasion, drying out, etc. This helps to scatter light and make the horn look much lighter. Lightly sanding it, buffing it with tripoli powder in oil (or going up to very fine grades of paper if you can't get tripoli) and letting a film of neats foot oil sit on the scales (or filling up a thin jar with neatsfoot, opening the blade and submerging the scales in the oil) will make it look darker, shinier and more like it did when first made into scales.

Regards,
Neil

I've had a few people who want the old dirty bone/horn scales replaced, after 15 min of micro-mesh and oil while talking to them they want to keep them.
It's a lovely material.

IN a Polishing kit there is a bar of compound for plastic. Should I try that before hydrating in neatsfoot ? It would clean up the material and remove any foreign substances while smoothing out the outer layer???????

I usually oil first, in hopes that I won't have to sand. But it may be easier to sand while its dry...

When I oil, I put on a light coat at a time. Submerging is faster, but I always worry scales will get too much oil and get mushy, or that they will warp.