Thread: A Newbie's Experiment

OK, bear with me. I am purely speculating, as my first razor isn't due at my house until today or tomorrow (the suspense is killing me), but I'll take a stab at the tip vs. heel quandry.

Putting aside any personal stylistic movements, it may be a combination of ergonomics and physics.

Ergonomics, you have your hand close to the heel, while the tip is somewhat distant. The heel, therefore will move in an almost perfect 1:1 ratio with your hand motion. The tip, however, can move faster or slower than the heel based on the movement of your wrist and instantaneous position of the blade. Therefore you have a different control on the heel, than on the tip. Not better or worse, just different.

Physics, the tip is slightly harder to start motion in due to it's being distant (distal) to your hand. The effect is due to rotational inertial, and related to the distance from the center of mass, center or movement and a unit called the polar moment of inertia. This would make the tip a bit less responsive than the heel initially.

Both of these effects are very small, but then, there isn't a big difference between a cut and no-cut with a sharp instrument.

Just my engineer's $0.02.

John

You know something? I've been thinking about this and can see that I typed too soon without thinking things completely through.

I think I originally wanted to just document my personal experience without ever attempting to make an authoritative guide. If some new person, like myself, gleaned one thing that helped them, great but I never wanted to make a definitive resource.

Lynn has made, in my opinion, the ultimate definitive resource. That's the one resource all newbies should own.

I'm going to cancel this ridiculous idea of mine but feel free to opine away on other issues.

Steve, I certainly didn't mean to add any pressure or ruin any fun for ya. Everything I said was in total fun and hate to see you not do something you were raring to do. Now, probably anything I might have said was not important anyway but I wanted to just check myself. Later,

Justin

Hey Justin:

No, neither you nor Tony turned me off to this idea. I just started thinking about how it might look to others as a slap to Lynn or Anders or others.

I totally caught your humor and felt no additional pressure. It's simply a case of my hands typeth faster than my brain thinketh

I just wanted to note something about the tip (point) leading issue (well, I don't want it to be an issue...)
Maybe this is already understood, but the point of the razor can lead without actually touching the face. For instance it may be the center blade or the heel that is touching while the point is still leading. Does that make sense?

Also, as to short or long strokes: the manuals I have recommend short "sawing" strokes. Now before anyone yells "that's dangerous!!" it should be understood that the book doesn't mean a back and forth sawing motion. In fact, anyone who really understands a western style hand saw knows that it is only the forward stroke that does the cutting. The pull back is just to re-set the saw for the next cut. It should also be understood that the sawing motion is not an across cut motion with the razor (that of course would cut the face), but a downward motion relative to the direction of the beard grain.

Hope I didn't hijack or muddy up this thread. Sometimes I just need to


Scott

Originally Posted by honedright

I just wanted to note something about the tip (point) leading issue (well, I don't want it to be an issue...)
Maybe this is already understood, but the point of the razor can lead without actually touching the face. For instance it may be the center blade or the heel that is touching while the point is still leading. Does that make sense?

Also, as to short or long strokes: the manuals I have recommend short "sawing" strokes. Now before anyone yells "that's dangerous!!" it should be understood that the book doesn't mean a back and forth sawing motion. In fact, anyone who really understands a western style hand saw knows that it is only the forward stroke that does the cutting. The pull back is just to re-set the saw for the next cut. It should also be understood that the sawing motion is not an across cut motion with the razor (that of course would cut the face), but a downward motion relative to the direction of the beard grain.

Hope I didn't hijack or muddy up this thread. Sometimes I just need to


Scott

See, I understand how I might choose to do things aren't the "approved" method.

1. It's true the tip doesn't actually hit my face when I do tip forward. I simply find it more difficult and less comfortable to hold the blade tip forward on some parts of the face and as a result tend to cut myself.

2. I probably read the same barber manual (infact, just won a 1950's manual off Ebay and waiting for its arrival) and have tried the short strokes, again not as comfortable but I also understand the movement they are describing to be more of a down and diagonal (not back and forth) stroke.

These are just my experiences (or lack of experiences I suppose, too). In either case, no hijacking has occurred and your input is always welcome.

Originally Posted by steve

Hey Justin:

No, neither you nor Tony turned me off to this idea. I just started thinking about how it might look to others as a slap to Lynn or Anders or others.

I totally caught your humor and felt no additional pressure. It's simply a case of my hands typeth faster than my brain thinketh

Steve,
My concept was not to be a guide but rather the ponderings of a newbie who will likley face what every newbie might. In the end it would not instruct people what to do but rather something they could read that would be similar to the questions and trials they would experience and make them seek info and experiemnt much as you would on your journey.

Lynn has offered many paths to sucess in his DVD and we each (yes, even us old hands) take from it the path that works for us. I'd just like to see a piece on WHY someone chooses one path over another and how it worked or didn't for them.

Tony

Originally Posted by Tony Miller

Steve,
My concept was not to be a guide but rather the ponderings of a newbie who will likley face what every newbie might. In the end it would not instruct people what to do but rather something they could read that would be similar to the questions and trials they would experience and make them seek info and experiemnt much as you would on your journey.

Lynn has offered many paths to sucess in his DVD and we each (yes, even us old hands) take from it the path that works for us. I'd just like to see a piece on WHY someone chooses one path over another and how it worked or didn't for them.

Tony

Tony,

I appreciate the clarification. I guess I just didn't want to step on any toes or show disrespect.

So, "the ponderings of a newbie", huh? Maybe Xman can suggest a title. I'm thinking a rip off on a Shakespeare quote..."Oh, for a muse of lather"

Well, I guess I don't mind giving a try so long as we all understand this is not ever intended as a guide, but just what you said, ponderings..

Steve

Steve,

This could be really cool, especially if you include links in the text to threads where you posed questions and had them answered. There was a really good thread that X started a long time ago that showed his progression from a honing novice to lead singer of the Rolling Hones. It was really instructive and encouraging to me when I was getting started.

Just a thought,
Josh

Originally Posted by JoshEarl

Steve,

This could be really cool, especially if you include links in the text to threads where you posed questions and had them answered. There was a really good thread that X started a long time ago that showed his progression from a honing novice to lead singer of the Rolling Hones. It was really instructive and encouraging to me when I was getting started.

Just a thought,
Josh

Oh no, ---The Rolling Hones???? the only reason I groan at that is because I didn't think of it first

You have a good idea Josh, there are definatley some threads I would include as well as article links.

Alright then, let me think about some things and reply tomorrow. This seems like it's turning out to be a little more that I had thought and I want to be sure I have some sort of outline to guide myself by.

Thanks everyone for the encouragement and suggestions. As for now, I'm off to class.