How sharp is sharp enough? What let's you know when a refresh or honing is needed?

I'm wondering how people decide not to just strop and decide to refresh with a coarser strop prior to the leather final strop. Also, when do you decide not to use the coarser strop and go right to stones, basically starting over?

I've been learning to hone and strop for a few months so up til now all I have been doing is just keeping the edge as sharp as I could. Good news though. Approximately 3-4 weeks ago I began being able to cut hairs on my arm above the skin and cutting hairs consistently using the hanging hair test. I consider this the beginning of being able to create shave ready edges. Just the beginning. I still have improvement and better edges to look forward to. For now, to learn how much sharpness is lost on one shave I try the hanging hair test after I shave. I can never cut a hanging hair after I shave. Then I have done up to 100 passes on a leather strop. At that point when I drag the hair over the edge the hair vibrates significantly but seldom cuts. But if I do 20-30 passes on a poly-webbing strop with .5 micron CBN on it the edge will cut hanging hairs some but not that consistently. Add 50-70 passes on the leather strop and then the edge is back to cutting the hair on every attempt. Sometimes I may drag the hair about 1/4" then it cuts. Sometimes it cuts immediately. That's when I put the razor down considering it ready for the next shave. I'm thinking I should just shave then do 100 passes on the leather strop to get ready for the next shave and see how it goes. I think what I'm doing now is refreshing the edge after every shave by using both strops. After I shave and then strop 50-100 passes on the leather strop and it won't cut a hanging hair, is this razor still considered shave ready? I have been shaving for months now with a razor that won't cut a hanging hair. I guess that answer's my question. I'm not sure that counts though because I was shaving with non-shve ready edges only because I couldn't get them any sharper.

I don't think most of you guys go through all this between every shave and I don't want to do it either. Not for the rest of my life anyway. I may be an odd-ball. Has anyone else gone through trying to learn how much sharpness is lost on one shave on your face? I'm sure this loss will be different per person based on any number of things like thickness of a beard, whiskers and other stuff. Maybe the type of steel the razor is made of will effect edge retention. Since I don't want to be cutting hanging hairs much longer I am wondering how you decide it's time to either refresh or completely re-hone the razor. Do you start cutting yourself? Does the razor try to drag your skin off your face because it won't cut the whiskers?

When do you consider your razors NOT shave ready and in need of more than an every day stropping? I guess if I just do a simple stropping between a few shaves I'll learn how the razors I hone hold up on my face. Maybe I should try doing nothing to the razor except drying it between shaves to see how long the shave stays comfortable.

The only "Test" that matters is the shave test, when the razor starts to pull and hesitate it needs a refresh, when it doesn't cut as perfect a swath and starts to leave behind hairs it needs a refresh... period end of story :p All the other tests are for the honing operations

You are doing way to much, or as we like to say "Less is More"

You could also take up the Maintenance routine where you refresh at a certain time instead of when you feel it say every 2 week or monthly.. that also works


ps: Stropping right before the shave while the lather sets up is the most effective I have found

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by gssixgun

The only "Test" that matters is the shave test, when the razor starts to pull and hesitate it needs a refresh, when it doesn't cut as perfect a swath and starts to leave behind hairs it needs a refresh... period end of story :p All the other tests are for the honing operations

You are doing way to much, or as we like to say "Less is More"

You could also take up the Maintenance routine where you refresh at a certain time instead of when you feel it say every 2 week or monthly.. that also works


ps: Stropping right before the shave while the lather sets up is the most effective I have found

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I didn't know letting the lather set up is something to do. What is the benifit of letting lather set up? I have been doing anything else I need to first so when I get the lather going good I can apply it to my face immediately.

I gave up on the HHT a long time ago. it can vary a lot just depending on the hair you are using. the shave test is all that matters.

I will do a few tests prior to the shave test to let me know if I should even attempt a shave test. Once a razor is shave ready and in rotation most times if one of my razors isn't shaving to my standards, meaning it will give a good shave just not as good as I am looking for, I won't go straight to refreshing the edge. I will actually give the razor one more chance incase my prep or technique was subpar, which most times this is the cause, and if on the next shave it still isn't any better than I will go with refreshing the edge. I seem to be rather heavy handed with my dominant hand so it will throw off my shaves if I am not paying especial attention.

Hey Guys, I know that my blade needs a bit of a touch up when the stroke on my philtrum (yes I did have to look it up) gets a bit tuggy.I find it is one of the most sensitive parts of my face to shave and I can use any part of the blade to take the stroke.Sounds like you are doing an inordinate amount of work, I will usually tree top a few arm hairs to check the blade is pining nicely but only after a hone.Have a look at the Beginners, 1K shave http://straightrazorpalace.com/honin...shave.htmlThis seems like a really good place to start and it has a fair bit of information on various stones as well as when the bevel is set.

philtrum...... hmmm didn't know it had a name, had to google it when I read your post! ;)

Isn't that why you blow air into your upper lip so it disappears!!

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Originally Posted by Jack0458

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I didn't know letting the lather set up is something to do. What is the benifit of letting lather set up? I have been doing anything else I need to first so when I get the lather going good I can apply it to my face immediately.

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This vid although more about "What a Shave test is" has some good tips about prep too..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93zQP7CToWQ

The lather actually "sets up" after it is applied to the face, given a minute or two (About the same time as stropping 25/50 Linen/Leather) it will stiffen the whiskers and lift them away from the face, making mowing them down much easier. It is rarely discussed on the forum but try it and see..

I think I have a philtrum. I haven't seen it in 37 years. The cookie duster has been with me a long time.

Ed

I have some small lay flat whiskers at the bottom of my chin. When the blade doesn't cleanly slice those off going WTG, it is time to refresh the blade. If that doesn't work it is time to get out the stones.

I found early on I probably did the most blade damage with bad stropping. Now the stropping will materially improve the edge I have.

But definitely figuring out some place on your face where a sharp razor does the best and then paying close attention to how that area works? Best test!

Today I even go as far as switching to the rotation razor if the current one doesn't do those whiskers well, and then I do some blade maintenance. Definitely the best reason to have more than one SR.

Good luck!

Ed

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Crackers

Hey Guys, I know that my blade needs a bit of a touch up when the stroke on my philtrum (yes I did have to look it up) gets a bit tuggy.I find it is one of the most sensitive parts of my face to shave and I can use any part of the blade to take the stroke.

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Yep, the philtrum is the best sensor/indicator for me as well!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jack0458

I'm wondering how people decide not to just strop and decide to refresh with a coarser strop prior to the leather final strop. Also, when do you decide not to use the coarser strop and go right to stones, basically starting over?

I've been learning to hone and strop for a few months so up til now all I have been doing is just keeping the edge as sharp as I could. Good news though. Approximately 3-4 weeks ago I began being able to cut hairs on my arm above the skin and cutting hairs consistently using the hanging hair test. I consider this the beginning of being able to create shave ready edges. Just the beginning. I still have improvement and better edges to look forward to. For now, to learn how much sharpness is lost on one shave I try the hanging hair test after I shave. I can never cut a hanging hair after I shave. Then I have done up to 100 passes on a leather strop. At that point when I drag the hair over the edge the hair vibrates significantly but seldom cuts. But if I do 20-30 passes on a poly-webbing strop with .5 micron CBN on it the edge will cut hanging hairs some but not that consistently. Add 50-70 passes on the leather strop and then the edge is back to cutting the hair on every attempt. Sometimes I may drag the hair about 1/4" then it cuts. Sometimes it cuts immediately. That's when I put the razor down considering it ready for the next shave. I'm thinking I should just shave then do 100 passes on the leather strop to get ready for the next shave and see how it goes. I think what I'm doing now is refreshing the edge after every shave by using both strops. After I shave and then strop 50-100 passes on the leather strop and it won't cut a hanging hair, is this razor still considered shave ready? I have been shaving for months now with a razor that won't cut a hanging hair. I guess that answer's my question. I'm not sure that counts though because I was shaving with non-shve ready edges only because I couldn't get them any sharper.

I don't think most of you guys go through all this between every shave and I don't want to do it either. Not for the rest of my life anyway. I may be an odd-ball. Has anyone else gone through trying to learn how much sharpness is lost on one shave on your face? I'm sure this loss will be different per person based on any number of things like thickness of a beard, whiskers and other stuff. Maybe the type of steel the razor is made of will effect edge retention. Since I don't want to be cutting hanging hairs much longer I am wondering how you decide it's time to either refresh or completely re-hone the razor. Do you start cutting yourself? Does the razor try to drag your skin off your face because it won't cut the whiskers?

When do you consider your razors NOT shave ready and in need of more than an every day stropping? I guess if I just do a simple stropping between a few shaves I'll learn how the razors I hone hold up on my face. Maybe I should try doing nothing to the razor except drying it between shaves to see how long the shave stays comfortable.

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Hey Jack. I used to do the same thing as you as far as testing the blade with a HHT and in fact still do if I have the time. This is such a personal thing and very subjective that you will have to find your own way through experimenting. Once a razor is "shave ready" there is a long way to go before it is as sharp as I like it. Sure it shaves without tugging or skipping but it's a ways to go before I get effortless BBS shaves with that same razor. In order to maintain this level of sharpness it takes about 30 seconds more for me by doing 10-15 laps on FeOx and then stropp and once a week I use CrOx. If I am in a hurry I accept a "less than" which is still way above the "shave ready" mark. Then again I guess it's how you define shave ready. Back to the subjective thing. So my advice would be to find what works for you by experimenting for yourself.

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Originally Posted by Steel

Hey Jack. I used to do the same thing as you as far as testing the blade with a HHT and in fact still do if I have the time. This is such a personal thing and very subjective that you will have to find your own way through experimenting. Once a razor is "shave ready" there is a long way to go before it is as sharp as I like it. Sure it shaves without tugging or skipping but it's a ways to go before I get effortless BBS shaves with that same razor. In order to maintain this level of sharpness it takes about 30 seconds more for me by doing 10-15 laps on FeOx and then stropp and once a week I use CrOx. If I am in a hurry I accept a "less than" which is still way above the "shave ready" mark. Then again I guess it's how you define shave ready. Back to the subjective thing. So my advice would be to find what works for you by experimenting for yourself.

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Thanks Steel. What are BBS shaves? I didn't know I was going to learn acronyms to be able to shave. :) It seems that 90% of shaving with a straight razor is all about what works for you (or me). I don't think I've asked one question and someone said "whatever he says" and I had my answer. Makes me wonder why anyone would go through the trouble to learn this way of shaving. I am enjoying straight shaving though including finding what works for me.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jack0458

Thanks Steel. What are BBS shaves? I didn't know I was going to learn acronyms to be able to shave. :) It seems that 90% of shaving with a straight razor is all about what works for you (or me). I don't think I've asked one question and someone said "whatever he says" and I had my answer. Makes me wonder why anyone would go through the trouble to learn this way of shaving. I am enjoying straight shaving though including finding what works for me.

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Sorry. BBS stands for baby butt smooth. I enjoy the challenge of learning my way through. It is not a quick learn but has a big learning curve but the results are MORE than rewarding and worth the effort.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jack0458

Makes me wonder why anyone would go through the trouble to learn this way of shaving.

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The first time you have a few phenomenal BBS shaves in a row. You'll be hooked. When I nail a perfect shave? It feels like I'm running wet fingertips across smooth wet glass when I touch my face. And the shave stays like that until late that night.

Every shave isn't that way, but the best shaves are unbelievably good. Better than any other way I have ever shaved. And personally I got really tired of the five blade fusion system including the costs: $28 for 8 cartridges just seemed excessive. The soaps are better. The results are better. And this might sound bizarre but I actually like doing the blade maintenance. I buy one tool and I keep it sharp. It just keeps working. I don't throw it away.

my .02,


Ed

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jack0458

Thanks Steel. What are BBS shaves? I didn't know I was going to learn acronyms to be able to shave. :) It seems that 90% of shaving with a straight razor is all about what works for you (or me). I don't think I've asked one question and someone said "whatever he says" and I had my answer. Makes me wonder why anyone would go through the trouble to learn this way of shaving. I am enjoying straight shaving though including finding what works for me.

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That is certainly a relevant question. I wondered early on at times why I was bothering with it too. It is worth doing, but early in the process it is difficult, takes time and patience, and it takes time, taking me a month or two to get even decent shaves. After you pay your dues, which are unavoidable, you will find that you get great shaves and have learned a skill that you can be proud of.

Jack-As you get better at both honing and stropping, you will find that your shaves just keep getting better and better. I actually enjoy doing what you are describing, trying the HHT before the shave, then stropping 50-100 laps and checking again. I also strop about 20-30 linen and 50 leather immediately post shave, and then usually another leisurely 50 after the razor has sat and dried for the day before finally putting it away. I actually enjoy stropping in a mindless, zen sort of way, and my edges and face both approve. Once every few shaves, I'll make 10 passes on CrOx linen if the edge needs it. As you have noted, whatever works for you applies, as does less is more (though we extreme stroppers ignore go the opposite route).

Hey, Extreme Stroppers sounds like a reality show idea.:hmmm:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jack0458

Thanks Steel. What are BBS shaves? I didn't know I was going to learn acronyms to be able to shave. :) It seems that 90% of shaving with a straight razor is all about what works for you (or me). I don't think I've asked one question and someone said "whatever he says" and I had my answer. Makes me wonder why anyone would go through the trouble to learn this way of shaving. I am enjoying straight shaving though including finding what works for me.

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That's funny. It wasn't until I started to listen to what others said that I started to really get things working. Took me a while to actually start listening vs taking in what I wanted and ignoring everything else lol. It's all a package really.

Anyway - this was kind of a timely read for me. Today just for fun, I honed a blade on a stone I was only going to use on my knives. An Arkansas black.

After I honed it up, I lathered up my face and let it set as I stropped the blade. Just before I put it to my face I noted I hadn't once taken the blade to my arm. I was shocked. I mean I had looked at it under the loop - I knew it would shave, just wasn't sure how smooth it would be. When did I stop "testing my work" on my arm lol??

That's all to say, in time it will not be anywhere as complicated. For me that took a while as am a little bull headed. But you know, being bullheaded has taught me a great deal!!

And yes - I agree, less is more. When you are ready, you'll see it. Or maybe you will not. Doesn't matter if your face is happy.

Happy shaving!! It's fun to use a straight :)

Hey, Extreme Stroppers sounds like a reality show idea.:hmmm:[/QUOTE]

Tonight on Extreme Stroppers, will ScoutHikerDad just go to the linnen and then to the leather or will he go to the CrOx???
Does he need to do as many passess as he does???? find out tonight on EEEEXXXTTTTTREEEMMMMMEEE STROPPERRRSSS ers ers ers....

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Originally Posted by earcutter

That's funny. It wasn't until I started to listen to what others said that I started to really get things working. Took me a while to actually start listening vs taking in what I wanted and ignoring everything else lol. It's all a package really.

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I do the same thing. When I don't agree with what someone recommends I ignore it. For some reason I ignore what the people with 20 years experience advise. It's like I think I know better than they do. I know I don't but I act like it sometimes. One day I'll wise up. :)

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Originally Posted by Jack0458

I don't think I've asked one question and someone said "whatever he says" and I had my answer.

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Nailed it! Ask a question and you will get many different answers based on people's experience and perception. Which is a great thing if you are willing to explore all the different options, opinions, and answers. One way to narrow the field is to get a mentor. I found someone with experience that I trusted wasn't out to sell me something and then worked with him and just a couple others mainly through PM's although I still ask a question on the boards when I am looking for a range of answers. Both ways have their benefit. The fun is in the journey. Best of luck.

Jack, it is really not that complicated… we on this forum do tend to make it sound more complex than it is, because half of us are hooked and after the perfect edge and shave… chasing a ghost.

But getting a good shave is not that hard, depending on the razor, the driver’s skills, and the equipment, (hones and strops).

Some photos of your razor may help and more information on how the razors were honed.

Sounds to me like you edge may be breaking down or as said it could be a stropping issue. It can take some time to learn to strop properly as one miss-stroke can wipe an edge.

The benefit of Straight Razor shaving is the ability to tailor a razor’s edge to your face and beard. Once there, it can easily be maintained for a very long time with a minimum of cost and effort.

Find a local mentor and cut your learning curve with some hands on coaching, it may be something very simple.

Agree with Euclid 440.
Would be helpful to see your razor and know what you are honing with.

I agree with Glen - Its ultimately down to how the blade shaves.

If it pulls, is uncomfortable or scratchy, or doesnt remove hair properly then you need a touch up.

IME if its slighly uncomfortable I find a finisher is enough to bring it back. If its pulling as well, then I'll do 8k and the finisher, and if its not removing hair properly then I'll go down to 4k, then 8k and then finisher.

I too gave up on the HHT as its so variable. Off my honing I pass HHT about 60% of the time, my dad passes every time and mate of mine couldnt get it to pass at all. One razor, three results, but the shave was great we all agreed hehe :D

All of the tests you hear about (HHT, shaving arm hair, TPT, TNT and so on..) are only really useful when honing to check how an edge is progressing. Once you've been through the honing process the only thing that matters is the shave.

For me I do the TNT to check how a bevel is forming, then see if I can shave arm hair off the 1k. Off the 4k I should be able to start popping arm hair holding the razor about 1mm above the skin, off the 8k I should be able to easily pop arm hair above the skin and then I'm just adding smoothness with either SG 16k or SS12k plus a natural finisher.

Once it gets to the shave test though, its all the steps I first mentioned.

Good luck and keep us posted!

Here is a picture of my razor (one I use most). It is a Boker a friend gave me with no handle. I made a handle from G-10 (blue/black layers). I have one more razor. Also the stones I use for razors (and knives). Shapton glass stones. I keep them flat, lapping them whenever needed. The strop is a rich man's strop from whippeddog.com. The poly-webbing has .5 micron CBN spray on it right now. I have some .5 micron chromium oxide paste ordered.

http://i800.photobucket.com/albums/y...ps9f32ef2b.jpg

http://i800.photobucket.com/albums/y...ps5302b412.jpg

http://i800.photobucket.com/albums/y...ps8d27491c.jpg

While I need lots of improvement I can say I see an improvement in my honing and especially my stropping ability. I can get the edge to cut hanging hairs now. But, after one shave they won't cut a hair. Not even once. So I was wondering at what point WHEN TESTING would it be time to do more than strop with the leather? When should I use the poly-webbing strop? When do I need to go all the way back to stones? Since I can't shave often enough to test my edges by just shaving I've been doing the HHT to see the condition of the edge from heel to toe. From your comments it seems a razor can still give a good shave even when it won't cut a hanging hair. After my razor will cut hanging hairs and I shave once it won't cut a hair. Then after I strop on leather it still won't cut a hair. But if I go back to the webbing (with .5 micron CBN) I can once again cut hanging hairs. So, to get good shaves do I need to go to the webbing for 20 or so passes then the leather or just use the leather? This is the type of thing I was wondering. I'm still doing the HHT because I don't trust my stropping. I have tested the edge by cutting arm hair above the skin. Has anyone else ever cut off all their arm hair or am I the only one? Once I trust my stropping I'll be able to strop then shave without testing I hope. :) I've been working on honing and stropping for a few months and just now am I able to get the razor to cut hanging hairs. This is a pretty important milestone in the learning curve I think. So I still enjoy the sight of a hair being cut. The thing about a razor NOT cutting a hanging hair is I don't know how sharp it is. I get knives to shave arm hair to the skin in one pass but they won't cut a hair above the skin. And a razor needs to be sharper than I get knives. Unless I'm wrong (usually am) I'm getting the edge pretty good and it will improve over time due to more experience. I'll still be asking questions though. You guys on this forum have helped me more than I'll ever know. I appreciate that. Now shaving (the reason for it all :)) is the thing I need to improve on. I will. I'm not giving up. There is no way everyone who uses a straight razor would have gone through the learning curve unless there was a pot of gold somewhere. :) I'm sure there have been lots of people who had to learn without any help. They had it much harder. I've pictured the cowboys like in the movies who rode for days or weeks and then showing up in a barbershop somewhere for a shave. Of course in the movies a man in a barber's chair with a face full of lather and a sheet over him usually resulted in someone getting shot. Maybe too many Clint Eastwood movies??? :)

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Originally Posted by Jack0458

There is no way everyone who uses a straight razor would have gone through the learning curve unless there was a pot of gold somewhere. :)

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The Journey is the "Pot Of Gold" all the little successes along the way...

How sharp is sharp enough... The standard that I would have to use would be: my Feather Straight razor with a ProGuard blade.
Have used feathers and Kai's other blades and have to say that the ProGuard is sharp enough for me[emoji33]

Jack, are you using magnification to look at the bevel and edge?

Your razor has a bit of a smiling edge which makes it more difficult for a novice razor honer to obtain an even sharp edge.

A better test than hair, (which does not work for everyone), is to look at the edge with magnification. Any shiny spots are where the bevels are not meeting, if you are lucky a large amount of polishing on finer stones may bring them together, but not completely from heel to toe.

Knife sharpening and razor honing are two different skill sets. While some of the tools are similar the goals are very different.

First, set the bevel… Do not move on to the next polishing stone until you are absolutely sure the bevel is completely set from heel to toe.

Then each progressive stone, removes the previous stone’s stria without damaging the edge.
With a smiling edge, some body English is required, there are many posts and videos on how to accomplish this.

I suspect you are very close to a good shaving edge, but have not completely set the bevel, and stropping is bringing the edge together in some places, not completely.

Here is a video on visually inspect the edge to ensure the bevel is set.
Here.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jack0458

After my razor will cut hanging hairs and I shave once it won't cut a hair. Then after I strop on leather it still won't cut a hair.

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It sounds to me like you are shaving with too high of an angle.

Another thing it could be is the razor. Does this happen on more than one razor? I had a razor that behaved that way while all of my other razors did not. I finally determined that the bevel angle on that one razor was too acute, ~15 degrees, for the steel/temper of that razor. I have since reduced the bevel angle to 17 degrees and now the razor holds its edge. I have other razors with bevel angles ~15 degrees that hold up fine. Changing the bevel angle is a pretty major honing mod and I'm not suggesting that you do it, just bringing it up as a possible cause. If this is happening with other razors, it is extremely unlikely that this is the problem.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bluesman7

It sounds to me like you are shaving with too high of an angle.

Another thing it could be is the razor. Does this happen on more than one razor? I had a razor that behaved that way while all of my other razors did not. I finally determined that the bevel angle on that one razor was too acute, ~15 degrees, for the steel/temper of that razor. I have since reduced the bevel angle to 17 degrees and now the razor holds its edge. I have other razors with bevel angles ~15 degrees that hold up fine. Changing the bevel angle is a pretty major honing mod and I'm not suggesting that you do it, just bringing it up as a possible cause. If this is happening with other razors, it is extremely unlikely that this is the problem.

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When you say "shave with too high of an angle" do you mean the angle of the razor on my skin or the bevels? I've read several statements that already have me thinking I'm keeping the angle too high. Spine too far from my skin.

Then you talk about bevels. Isn't the only way to lower the bevel (edge) angle is to remove steel from the spine? Or if you wanted to raise the angle of the edge would you need to apply tape or something to the spine then re-set the bevels? Please explain this. I come from a knife sharpening mindset and re-profiling knife edges to higher or lower angles I'm very familiar with. How to do it on a razor though I need instruction. It's about impossible to mess a knife up beyond repair. But it might be easy to screw a razor up beyond repair. Removing too much steel from one side of the spine for example. The far end of this action would be a razor edge that looked like a wood chisel.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jack0458

When you say "shave with too high of an angle" do you mean the angle of the razor on my skin or the bevels? I've read several statements that already have me thinking I'm keeping the angle too high. Spine too far from my skin.
The correct angle sees the spine close to the skin as opposed to "far' from the skin.

Then you talk about bevels. Isn't the only way to lower the bevel (edge) angle is to remove steel from the spine?
First establish what the angle is. There is a thread about this some where on SRP with a formula. Personally I've never bothered. AFAIC razors have a use by date but I would bet yours is not the case.

It's about impossible to mess a knife up beyond repair. But it might be easy to screw a razor up beyond repair. Removing too much steel from one side of the spine for example. The far end of this action would be a razor edge that looked like a wood chisel.

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Razors with a wood chisel profile shave really well. :p Don't do it to a western razor tho . ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jack0458

When you say "shave with too high of an angle" do you mean the angle of the razor on my skin or the bevels? I've read several statements that already have me thinking I'm keeping the angle too high. Spine too far from my skin..

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Yes, shaving with too high of an angle would have the spine too far from your skin. If you are having trouble with more than one razor it points to shaving technique, not a problem with the razor geometry.

A year in...1. Get your 1st razor honed by a pro. You will end up with more than one believe me. At least you will have a reference point. When you begin decide whether you wish to learn to hone/sharpen your own razor/s. If yes, if you buy a new razor, although they may be less than shave ready, an 8K stone is all you need for a hone. Most who have half a dozen razors of different types manage with 3 hones, bevel setter (1K) 8K and maybe a higher grit finisher such as a 12 K, but one razor, just use the 8K. Importantly, this forum is a font of knowledge. Everything I have picked up that has been 'right' and 'effective' has come from this site. All the guys will help you. If you are close to an experienced member, I'm sure he'd help you. Some things are a personal choice like 'tape' and 'slurry', none is totally wrong or right, that's the beauty of this hobby. It requires skill with brain and hand. Use the brains on SRP as a library, you will pick up bits you like or not, but moderators/mentors here...if they don't know, no one will lol. Enjoy your evolving hobby, it's great. Also buy yourself a Styptic pencil.....you will need it.....lol

Bobski

I have a vintage 1930's or 40's henckel #17 that is such a phenomenal shaver but what sets it appart may really be the steel. This also a factor and why some razors retain their edge longer.

Just as an example, I alwasy hone a bunch of razors at the same time since I already have my hones out... Last time I honed I honed a Puma, a Thiers Issard and another Henckel all from around the 60's-70's at the same time as the vintage henckel 17. I used them in a rotation and after a few shaves the only one which is still very much shave ready is the vintage henckels, all the others have degraded into not giving the most comfortable shave anymore.

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Originally Posted by samircanada

I have a vintage 1930's or 40's henckel #17 that is such a phenomenal shaver but what sets it appart may really be the steel. This also a factor and why some razors retain their edge longer.

Just as an example, I alwasy hone a bunch of razors at the same time since I already have my hones out... Last time I honed I honed a Puma, a Thiers Issard and another Henckel all from around the 60's-70's at the same time as the vintage henckel 17. I used them in a rotation and after a few shaves the only one which is still very much shave ready is the vintage henckels, all the others have degraded into not giving the most comfortable shave anymore.

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Totally agree with you re the steel. I have a vintage 651 dorko and a MoDoSo, which of the nine razors I own are my best and have the best longevity. Of the nine, 4 are vintage and five new. I like the Dovo's 'Prima Klang' 5/8, and the Dovo Bismarck 6/8, but as you correctly say, the steel way back then seems to have more tenacity than some of todays steel. The Henckel sounds like a lovely blade, good on you.
Bobski

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Originally Posted by samircanada

I have a vintage 1930's or 40's henckel #17 that is such a phenomenal shaver but what sets it appart may really be the steel. This also a factor and why some razors retain their edge longer.

Just as an example, I alwasy hone a bunch of razors at the same time since I already have my hones out... Last time I honed I honed a Puma, a Thiers Issard and another Henckel all from around the 60's-70's at the same time as the vintage henckel 17. I used them in a rotation and after a few shaves the only one which is still very much shave ready is the vintage henckels, all the others have degraded into not giving the most comfortable shave anymore.

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Something wrong with this picture if a TI or Puma of that vintage didn't hold an edge for a few shaves.

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Originally Posted by onimaru55

Something wrong with this picture if a TI or Puma of that vintage didn't hold an edge for a few shaves.

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No no amigo, nothing wrong as they all had the same number of shaves (say 7-10 shaves or so) and they are at the stage where they would need a refresh with 10k hone and/or CrOx where as the vintage henckels actually probably had 4-5 more shaves and still it's not even at the stage where I wouldnt want to do a CrOx paste yet.

Also, I am middle eastern and I probably could light a match on my face.

I agree. If you have to go to the stones after 10 shaves… something is wrong.

How were they honed? How were they maintained?

The problem is novice shavers will read your post and think this is normal… it I not… something is wrong.

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Originally Posted by Euclid440

I agree. If you have to go to the stones after 10 shaves… something is wrong.

How were they honed? How were they maintained?

The problem is novice shavers will read your post and think this is normal… it I not… something is wrong.

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I'm a novice shaver. Is the following true? I may need to use a stone (I have 8k and 16k) after 10 shaves if my stropping skill is not as good as it will be in the future. As my stropping skill improves I'll need to use the stones less often. Does this sound accurate?