For me, I shave with a gap between my face and the spine of the razor of about 1-2 spine widths and at times even less yet going ATG. If I open the gap up more I get irritation from scraping the whiskers off not shaving them off. With a DE/SE if you drop the handle past a certain point and that point can vary depending on the head design of the particular razor, you are again into scraping not shaving.