Thread: A bit puzzled

This morning I decided to refresh the edge of my Dovo half hollow using a Belgian Blue. I have had good results using this stone with a full hollow Dovo but today the half seemed dull. Anyway, I took the full hollow from its storage and wiped the oil off the blade, then gave both razors 30/60 felt/leather and shaved with both. Using the half hollow I shaved the left side with my left (non dominant) hand and vice versa with the full hollow. The half hollow, despite not appearing as sharp to TPT, was clearly the better shaver. Maybe its just confirmation that the only real test is the shave.

There is a lot going on in the shave test, so it can be much more comprehensive and revealing than something like the HHT.

When you referred to the half hollow seeming "dull", how did you determine that?

Hi,
Sorry, but the half hollow appeared dull to the TPT, in comparison to the full. The half not really dragging and the full seemed to want to cut my thumb off. Its possibly just the feel of the different grind.

The various tests, including the hanging hair test (HHT), should only be done to assess progress during honing. After honing is completed, the only assessment of you razor should be the shave test. The best way to determine when a touch up of the blade should be done is when you notice a diminishment in the quality of the shave. Leave your thumb out of it!

Originally Posted by Edgeof40

Hi,
Sorry, but the half hollow appeared dull to the TPT, in comparison to the full. The half not really dragging and the full seemed to want to cut my thumb off. Its possibly just the feel of the different grind.

I doubt the difference in sensations on the TPT was a function of the grind, although the grind does have some effect on the edge. In a sense, the Shave Test is the ultimate test because what does it mean if your edge passes the TPT and HHT and yet you can't shave with it?

Hmmm. The Belgian Blue, besides being a very slow stone isn't exactly known as a fine finisher. You might try something else.

Originally Posted by Utopian

The various tests, including the hanging hair test (HHT), should only be done to assess progress during honing. After honing is completed, the only assessment of you razor should be the shave test. The best way to determine when a touch up of the blade should be done is when you notice a diminishment in the quality of the shave. Leave your thumb out of it!

This advice is contrary to that given in the old barber manuals, by barber professionals, from a time when professional straight razor shaves were common. According to those texts, the razor should be tested on the thumb immediately after stropping to determine readiness for shaving.

It was worth it for me to acquire this skill because now I know every time that my razor is ready for a shave prior to lathering and shaving. A great time saver and a good way to really dial in on the shave readiness of your edge. Once the thumb pad test is learned correctly, and I suspect that the TPT is often performed and/ or interpreted incorrectly which is why, I think, there is so much debate over the value of it's use - if everyone could perform the test adequately, I can't imagine that there would be any debate at all.

Thanks guys,
For the time being, I think that I will touch up using CROX on balsa but should I consider buying a chinese 12k also. BTW for my TPT I hold the blade with edge pointing up and slowly and lightly move my thumb along it to see if it grabs the skin.
Ryan

Originally Posted by Edgeof40

Thanks guys,
For the time being, I think that I will touch up using CROX on balsa but should I consider buying a chinese 12k also. BTW for my TPT I hold the blade with edge pointing up and slowly and lightly move my thumb along it to see if it grabs the skin.
Ryan

This is how I was shown by a barber to perform the test:

http://straightrazorpalace.com/srpwi...Test_Video.AVI

notice that I am NOT moving my thumb along the blade in one continuous motion from heel to point as that would result in a bad cut. I am just lightly touching the edge with a very, very small amount of forward motion - just enough to feel the edge grab the skin, and then lift off away from the blade. Remember that the thumb tip should be a little wet as this facilitates sensation and softens the skin. On a very keen, shave ready edge, you will feel the edge grab the skin immediately. There will be no roughness or any otherwise unpleasant feeling. The edge will feel smooth and laser sharp (kind of a "holy cr@p that's sharp" moment) On a sharp, but not yet shave ready edge you may feel a slight grab, or it may feel smooth with almost no grab, or it may feel "grabby" but slightly rough. All of which tell you that you need to continue stropping (this "test" is not traditionally used while honing - there is another "test" for honing.). All of these sensations can be very subtle (although the shave ready keen edge is somewhat of an alarming sensation - you'll know it when you feel it!) it just takes practice to develop the knack.

It would be interesting to hear how much professionals can measure the readiness of a blade by these tests as they send out razors. For a hobbiest you can go back to the hone to fine tune your work, but I doubt they have time to shave test every blade they send out.
Lately the test that seems the most reliable for me is to barley touch an arm hair and see how it falls. If there is the slightest pull, I know my edge needs more work, if it falls with the lightest touch of the blade I am almost 100% sure it is ready for shaving.
TPT for the most part tells me when it is not good enough. For example, sticky sharp many times means that the blade will shave good but not feel great on the skin. I would like to get to the point with just a feel of the TPT that I could know without doubt where the edge really is at.