Thread: Pechika Yasuki

That's a bit general for yasuki steels, though. There are at least three classes of white, with the numbers given in that summary lining up with the top subclass of white #2 and blue #2.

I've used blue 1, blue 2, white 1 and white 2 (never saw white or blue 3), blue and white 2 are very common in hand tools. There are also specializations of the steels beyond just the white and blue (some of the tool makers get specialty lots and share them)

But specifically what I'm curious about is what is ysk2, is it white #2 (it doesn't seem like it) or blue #2? (maybe) or is it something specialty that is more highly alloyed (that also seems like a possibility).

It's simple it's either the white or the blue it's been around for sometime I've seen razors knives and scissors from the early 1960s made from YSK2 I doubt very much you are going to find much more info unless you PM Hitachi metals? or ask a question on one of the Japanese woodworking forums.

Originally Posted by celticcrusader

It's simple it's either the white or the blue it's been around for sometime I've seen razors knives and scissors from the early 1960s made from YSK2 I doubt very much you are going to find much more info unless you PM Hitachi metals? or ask a question on one of the Japanese woodworking forums.

Yeah, communication is an issue.

My point is that yasuki will do (and hitachi will do) a couple of tons of run if you make a special order for it. There's a gigantic difference between blue #2 and super blue, and a very large difference between a lower classification of white #2 and white #1 at a top classification (could be 1.4% carbon vs. 1.1% carbon). Top category white #1 has such a narrow temperature range that it's extremely hard to do properly. White #2, not so much, and white #2 is also often a bit softer than people specify (for example, folks may specify chisels at 64/65 hardness, but if you actually strike them, you find that they are 60-62 (I did that, which is why I bring it up). I think the same thing goes for knives and razors. People want to be able to say that they have a knife or razor almost as hard as carbide, but when they actually go to sharpen, use and maintain it, they'd have been better off with something pedestrian.

What was confusing to me about this razor is that it didn't behave like white 2, nor even blue 2. It could be extra hard, though, which makes any steel seem tougher on the stones than it would otherwise seem. You, me and everyone else pretty much has no chance of figuring out exactly what it is unless someone tells us.

(Fwiw, I thought it would be white or blue 2 - and probably blue 2 - because those are common and are really more suited to day to day use than something made of white #1 with the very small exception of the few who can actually consistently make something good out of white #1. I have exactly one good white #1 tool, I've had 3. The other two were OK, but in reality a good white #2 chisel or plane would've been better. If the smith making those two mediocre white #1 tools had done them perfectly, then they would've been better than white #2 ... but I think the skill and care required is a little too high).

Until I know, my money at lloyds is on these razors being something a little different than the white #2 and blue #2 stuff (and I don't think they're #1 anything). I think they have some more alloying elements in them specifically to make them more suitable for razors. Maybe more tungsten.

Yeah 64 65 Rockwell seems a little far fetched we are talking Rockstead knife hardness there, talking of your razor if it were 62 Rockwell which is still very hard and you are not likely to find anything harder in the razor world barring a Iwaski Tamahagane western style folding razor which I believe went up to rockwell 67.

Originally Posted by celticcrusader

Yeah 64 65 Rockwell seems a little far fetched we are talking Rockstead knife hardness there, talking of your razor if it were 62 Rockwell which is still very hard and you are not likely to find anything harder in the razor world barring a Iwaski Tamahagane western style folding razor which I believe went up to rockwell 67.

I've seen a lot of iwasaki's discussions about a razor that "should be about 67" or so. I would imagine that if he said that, he had a reason to. I'm not going to be the first person to see if it turns into shards in a rockwell tester (where would you test it, anyway, on the tang? that may not be representative).

I've found (not in any way that I have proof) that once edges get to a certain hardness, they don't behave on a strop the way I'd like them to. They are almost strop resistant and they have to be dead on super perfect from the stones.

My interest in all of this stuff about the pechika, is because that after using a lot of white steel #2 tools, I expected it to be something similar to white #2, and I really felt like I would probably get a collectible razor out of white #2 that in practice ends up not being as good to use as a simple "silver steel" or vintage german labeled razor. I'm glad to find out that I was wrong!

I'll probably not ever sell it, so it doesn't matter much, anyway. I already dropped the case it's in, which led to cracked scales at the bottom pin. Bummer! One thing is for sure, you crack scales on a $200 razor, and it's yours for good!! Doesn't matter how good of a repair job you do.

I've seen Iwasaki Tamahagane J-West boxes with hardnesses indicated as 67 (converted to Rockwell).

This being said, I have no idea how this figure is obtained, though I know they do vary from box to box.

I would imagine they would use a small piece of metal from the same batch as the razor then after they temper and quench the razor along with the small piece of metal I would guess they would then apply the Rockwell test to that piece then obviously apply the same hardness to the razor.