Thread: Japan Woodworker Iwasaki Razors--Finally Arrived!

Holli4pirating, can you explain how changing the geometry could deteriorate the razor?

Suppose you do hone the hollowest side of the blade 3 times as much as the less hollow side. The only thing you really change is the ratio of bevelwidths. How would that in the long run cause any harm?

If you look well you'll find that many razors have differences in width of the both bevels,most likely caused by some blade assymmetry or spine assymmetry.

I'm actually not certain that changing the geometry will affect the performance, which I did mention in my previous post. I just have a suspicion that it would. The blades are designed to be used in a certain way (a given side facing the face), and as such, the design is optimized for that particular orientation of the blade. I would imagine that is reflected in the bevel's geometry. That led me to the conclusion that changing the geometry would affect the shave.

Again, I'm not certain that there will actually be an affect, and if there is, I'm not sure that it would be noticable. I've shaved with warped razors, razors with uneven wear, and razors with very small chips in the blades and not been able to feel it. Then again, maybe someone else would have if they shaved with the same razors. Maybe the shaves were also slightly worse than the would have been if the razors were straight, even, and unchipped, but again, I didn't notice.

In the video of the Japanese girl's face shave her barber uses both sides of the razor. It is an odd razor with that fishing weight or whatever it is, but it does appear to be asymmetrical.

The chap who runs the other shaving board relates that when he spoke directly to Iwasaki (through an interpreter, of course), Iwasaki was clear and emphatic that his razors were meant to be used to shave with both sides. If anyone would know, it would be the razor maker, don't you think? So I think that puts paid to the canard about only shaving with the hollow side of the razor.

I rather agree with Kess, myths are told and re-told about the Japanese razors until they take the place of the truth.

Dan

Well I don't know about myths and what someone supposedly said to someone through an interpreter. The only thing I'll tell ya all is as I have said many times certainly you can shave with both sides and if you are getting equal results something is very wrong with the razor. I have both an iwasaki and Tosuke and a few other japanese razors and none of them shave equal using both sides. Shaving on the convex side always results in a rougher shave. They are equally close yes but the comparison stops there.

If you look at the razor both sides are different. Its that way for a reason. if it was intended to be used on both sides it would be designed like a western razor. Look at the profile of the razor and notice how the edge is canted towards the concave side. Its that way for a reason. Those are facts you can't deny. If you can think of another reason for this design I'm all ears.

The fact some people in japan use both sides doesn't mean squat. my wife likes to use my Wustoff kitchen Knives to pry up lids on cans. Would someone seeing that in japan think that's the way you should use a Western Kitchen Knife?

In the end its YMMV so you use and hone the razor as you see fit since its yours. If you get the results you want then your happy and I'm happy for you. Like I've always said there are many tools that people use improperly and they get great results from them and believe they are doing it the proper way.

Originally Posted by thebigspendur

Well I don't know about myths and what someone supposedly said to someone through an interpreter. The only thing I'll tell ya all is as I have said many times certainly you can shave with both sides and if you are getting equal results something is very wrong with the razor. I have both an iwasaki and Tosuke and a few other japanese razors and none of them shave equal using both sides. Shaving on the convex side always results in a rougher shave. They are equally close yes but the comparison stops there.

Or something is very wrong with the razor if you do NOT get equal results with the same side. That is a matter of opinion rather than fact.

Originally Posted by kevint

In the video of the Japanese girl's face shave her barber uses both sides of the razor. It is an odd razor with that fishing weight or whatever it is, but it does appear to be asymmetrical.

If even Japanese barbers use both sides would they be wrong too?

tbs, which side is convex? Both sides of my razor are hollow ground = concave. asymmetrically, but undoubtedly hollow

Originally Posted by kevint

tbs, which side is convex? Both sides of my razor are hollow ground = concave. asymmetrically, but undoubtedly hollow

As are mine. Another reason for the assymmetry might be that Japanese razors have no scales. If you lay them on one side the edge slightly sticks up in the air preventing damage to the edge.

Consider the lowly chisel: it is also ground asymmetrically; one side with a bevel, the other flat. (though in ancient times the primitive chisel had a double bevel)

it can be used bevel up, or bevel down; however, it is seldom if ever an "either, or" as equal techniques option- there should be a definite preference for one technique over the other depending on the task.

I suspect the asymmetry of the Japanese grind offers a similar option, possibly with or against the grain.

I might suggest we refer to the stamp side as ura and the face with the flat shinogi-ji as omote . (Though I could easily see how the terms could be used in reverse- whichever is correct)

I may not have visualized every option, but it seems like, even if these were only ever used traditionally in a barber/ client relationship, the barber would either have to move his position or at some point hold the razor in a reverse grip to avoid using both sides of the razor, such as shaving up. Neither of these options sound particularly feudally cool.

Since my Iwasaki arrived, I've had the opportunity to use it several times. First, I took it out of the box and tested it on the short hairs on my arm. I use short hairs because I believe they more closely resemble the face situation. When a razor is really sharp, I expect it to cut off a hair at the base and not leave a black dot.It did that right out of the box. I used the same prep routine as with other straights. The first shave was close but rough. The second time, I stropped it on both sides on a Hand American cordovan strop. The shave was extremely smooth and close. My benchmark instrument for closeness is a Gillette double edge called "The New", made in the 30's with a Feather stainless double edge blade. . I t was new old stock from e-bay. It is an open comb razor whose tines don't just arc out, but arc out and then bend down. I went through several razors over the course of a couple of years, and that one really left my face smooth. I can go any direction with it.

I shaved with both sides of the Iwasaki. I noticed that both sides showed evidence of honing,unlike some of my other Japanese knives which have an bevel like a chisel, and are meant to let the slices fall in a given direction.The bevel, the edge, on my Iwasaki is two sided, like that on a western knife. Whether the bevel has equal sides, I can't tell. So I used it on both sides, just switching sides as I moved from one facial or neck side to the other.

So far, the only straights which shaved like that out of the box were purchased from Straight Razor Designs. One is an 8/8 which I understand was in Lynn's collection, and the other was a Livi regrind.

I also noticed that the blackening does rub off. Some of it was slightly rubbed off when it arrived.

So far, after about 5 shaves, I did nothing to it but strop it. I don't know how I will proceed when stropping doesn't restore the sharpness.

Jerry