Thread: Pre 1800 Razor

Where is Neil Miller now that we really need him ? .......

In my initial research into this razor I came across a button from the Revolutionary War that had a crown with the letters RP under it. It was off of a coat issued to the Royal Provincials that was issued by the British to the colonists that fought for England. I sent the following email to a member of the Royalist Institute and received the following reply.
Greetings,
I have a question in regards to some of the gear issued to the Royal Provincials during the Revolutionary War. I have seen pictures of the buttons on the English issued jackets that the Royal Provincials wore. They had a crown with the initials R P under the crown. I have in my possession a pre 1800s straight razor that is marked R P under a crown and Cast Steel. I do know that cast steel was invented in 1772 and used early on predominately in England. I also know that the razor is pre 1800 by the way it is shaped.
My question is could the razor have been issued in the accouterments that the Royalist were issued. I have found list and references that tell many of the things they were issued but they end up saying and other accouterments. The crown and R P marks seem to lead me to the Royal Provincials. I would really appreciate any insight you could give me. By the way the razor came from an estate sale in upper New Jersey.
The reply that I received:
Razors for soldiers are not part of what the government issued to them. The term "accoutrements" is very specific, and refers only to cartridge boxes/pouches and bayonet belts. Razors would have been owned by every soldier though, as this was a very clean shaven period of history, with no facial hair whatsoever permitted in either the British or American armies. These items were purchased by each soldier mostly through the captain in whose company they belonged, and would have been considered as part of the soldier's "necessaries," meaning those additional items over and above the standard uniform issued him each year. They were mostly bought locally, and a deduction would be made in the soldier's pay for the cost of the item.
Now, as to your razor in particular... I cannot say definitely. The crown is very different from that used in the RP Buttons and by the British in general. But does it preclude it from being a Loyalist artifact? Not necessarily. This sort of material culture is not my strong point, being better with clothing and arms than items of this nature.

???? I am still wondering?

Originally Posted by JimmyHAD

That might be the case. Otherwise it is even more odd than it would have been if it does stand for the Regent Prince. I say that because according to Robert A. Doyle's "Collecting Straight Razors" the blade and the scales on this razor look like pre 1800. No distinct tang and absolutely straight scales.

Due to the wiki article saying the 'Regent Prince' began his tenure in 1811 I thought it was late for that blade and scale design. If the regent marks didn't begin until 1822 that is not only past the time for the Regent Prince but too far removed for the style of the blade.

I'm pretty sure the crown doesn't represent royalty, here.

this is very very interesting , although id love to score a razor like this , im having a blast reading this thread and the history involved in it .. !!!!

I'd PM manah, martin103, and Neilmiller for more info. Those 3 have wisdom seeping from their bones on stuff like this.

First off all - Jimmy: I have been sick!

Secondly, that's not a crown of any type. It is a typesetters representation of a fleur de lys - an iris flower. It's not like the boy scouts one, but that's what it is!

I have gone through a number of Sheffield Directories (1774, 1787, 1823, 1919) and have not found 'RP' under that particular motif. There are plenty of R.P.s from all those directories, but either with different marks, or different trades (spring knife makers, spotted knife makers, table knife makers, silver platers, steel makers, scissor makers and factors) so not really worth commenting on.

The motif in question was quite prevalent in the 1774 directory, but falls off to a handful of examples in the 1919 directory.

Thirdly, although a few makers do have their initials below the motif like this one:



Some are a bit more cryptic:





and some are just plain unhelpful:





NB: note that early examples of 'J' are printed as the latin version - 'I'

Of course, the razor might not have been made in Sheffield, but I doubt that. More research is called for!

Regards,
Neil