Thread: New Article - Hone Comparison Table

This:



is what I've always wanted to see to be able to understand where the different hones fit in the sharpening progression, how fast they cut and what sort of edge they produce, etc., but I was unable to express the wish not knowing what and how I wanted it exactly. You must have read my mind and then used your experience, intelligence and, err... Microsoft Excel to come up with this graph

Thanks you so much!

I don't have many hones, and I doubt my experience would do anybody much good, so I don't have much input for you. Are you going to include data about what kind of steel works best with the different hones?

Originally Posted by KristofferBodvin

BTW: People are reading this thread.
I think the whole concept is very interesting, but I can't really imagine how it would look like in the end.I guess there are a lot of people like me: Just getting the hang of honing, but so far away in experience from you guys that they/I much rather read what you post, than actually contribute with the little knowledge gained.

Originally Posted by crazycliff200843

I don't have many hones, and I doubt my experience would do anybody much good, so I don't have much input for you. Are you going to include data about what kind of steel works best with the different hones?

I'm afraid I have to disagree with both of you. The more people contribute, the more statistically correct the results will become. Clearly, if you have honed more than a couple of razors, you ought to have some idea how your hones relate to each other. No one can share hard figures, not even guys with vast experience, because there exists no real unity (ike e.g. inches or pounds) that we all know and use on a daily bases. Everybody's entries will be relative instead of absolute.
But when we have enough entries, we can statistically convolute the data of identical hones, rated by different people, and find out the median rating for each hone and calculate the deviation. It's more difficult to explain, when you don't know the correct English terms, than to do actually.

The main principle was brought up before, here on SRP. If you have a sack of beans and ask one person how much it weights, you know nothing about his answer. But when you ask 20 people, dismiss the extremes and calculate the median from the remaining results, the accuracy of the result can be amazing.

It takes 15 minutes tops, to think about your hones and fill the Excel file with your best educated guesses. Maybe for the guys of the HAD department a bit longer.

Next week I can try putting a form together in PDF format, that has easy pull down menus to enter the estimates. But it won't have the graphical feedback from the excel file.

The main question remains: does it makes sense to put this show together? If so, let us first think this thing trough with those that are willing to cooperate behind the scenes, and next actively start annoying certain SRP-members with pm-ing them questionaires.

Bart.

Originally Posted by Cornelius

This is what I've always wanted to see to be able to understand where the different hones fit in the sharpening progression, how fast they cut and what sort of edge they produce, etc., but I was unable to express the wish not knowing what and how I wanted it exactly.

It's for you, and all future aspiring honers, we're trying to make this work.
Thanks for the encouragement.

(On a side note: Excel has nothing to do with the graph. All my graphs are done in Coreldraw. Doing illustrative work happens to be part of how I earn my living.)

Bart.

Originally Posted by BeBerlin

You're a bloody genius.

Agreed. Very cool graph, Bart.

Originally Posted by Bart

(On a side note: Excel has nothing to do with the graph. All my graphs are done in Coreldraw.

Yeah, I figured it wasnt done in Excel after I posted. Also noticed a spelling mistake in my message... but I'm lazy

So where does the DMT 8 EE fit in here?

Originally Posted by Cornelius

Yeah, I figured it wasnt done in Excel after I posted. Also noticed a spelling mistake in my message... but I'm lazy

So where does the DMT 8 EE fit in here?

Very fast cutting 8k. Although whether or not the edge quality it leaves is truly 8k is debatable. It cuts so fast that alot of guys use it instead of a 4k.

Originally Posted by Cornelius

Yeah, I figured it wasnt done in Excel after I posted. Also noticed a spelling mistake in my message... but I'm lazy

So where does the DMT 8 EE fit in here?

In Shapton Glassstone terms, 3 micron is ≈5,000 grit. DMT calls it's 3 micron an 8,000 mesh. I believe the Japanese JIS scale calls 3 micron a 6,000: Grit, mesh, JIS, sheesh... This is a fine example of how useful a chart would/could be.

Thanks guys, but I meant where does it fit in Bart's Hone Graph, ie in between which other hones would it go, what shape and color would it be.

5k, 8k, microns, US, Japanese and German industry standards are all very good, but this graph really puts things into perspective IMO. If I know what to use, when to use it and what to expect, that means a lot more to me than a random number the accuracy of which will get challenged by several members!

Please note that the graph in this thread is only a draft for the sake of presenting an idea.
I have put almost no thought in the actual data that's currently in the graph.

If I were to draw a final version, based only on my own experiences, it would surely look different that this example. The current version is only a rough and quick estimation.

About the DMT"s. They are the flat and solid equivalent of (diamond) sandpaper. In the beginning they cut very aggressive, even after they're broken in, but as time goes by, they do become significantly smoother and also a little slower, just like any sandpaper would. Unlike almost all other hones, which release fresh particles, the DMT's have to abrade the steel with the same honing particles during their entire life-cycle. Once those diamonds are smoothed by use, they stay on that performance level a very long time. There's almost no way to reflect that in any chart or graph. For a short while, I have used a DMT-EE (8K), in new condition. Mine maxed out at a less keen level than the Belgian Blue. After I sold it, but held on to my other DMT's, I noticed that my DMT-E (1200) over time expanded its claim on sharpness significantly. I guess the DMT-EE would have done the same.

Bart.