Thread: Newbs and the wiki

Originally Posted by Slartibartfast

If there is something you do not like a wiki or think can be improved, PLEASE help us improve it!

I for one, as stated earlier in this thread, would love to invest the time needed to make it even better.
In fact, I'm gonna make that a priority in the next few weeks.
(having a broken foot has me just sitting around anyway)

The Wiki is a great resource, and really needs some updates...

But we always have to do both, Answer the question first, then link the Wiki,,, that gives the New guys the best chance of learning what we love here..

For awhile some were just linking the Wiki and basically saying "Look here dummy"

Others were doing it perfectly by saying "This is what I do dummy" "And here is more info in this" (insert Wiki link, or thread link)

I find it hard to use the Wiki. When I do come across an "answer" I sometimes don't really agree with it.

I find it annoying to try and avoid threads while bad information is posted in reply to questions. I have to deal with a lot of the fall out through PMs or phone conversations.

Beginner: "I heard that I should attack my shave ready razor with 1K grit for 16 hours, and now having done that, I have a few questions for you"

Me: "Let me guess, your not happy with the shave now?"

I find it annoying to deal with basic questions over and over again. I think sometimes I should just tell everyone "Yes, I strop every time before a shave, because the Wiki says so" and be done with it. That way there would always be a single answer for every problem.

I find it annoying to have to deal with questions, and poor replies, say about honing, when I know darn well the original poster isn't even honing. That drives me nuts.

"MMMMM, btw I was just wondering whats the best way to climb a mountain?" "Some day I might climb one, and I just wanted to check here first. Ya know?"

I agree completely about the need to do research to ask valuable questions, but I don't think the Wiki is, as it stands, the viable answer.

I wonder if it might make sense to post a FAQ thread (sticky) at the beginning of each forum. I forget, does every forum have something like that?

So, in the "Strops" forum we'd have a FAQ of strops and in the stropping forum a FAQ on stropping. ??

Originally Posted by AFDavis11

I find it annoying to deal with basic questions over and over again.

I think all of us that are long time members, especially those who've really participated a lot, risk burning out at some point. I know I have gone there and had to back up from time to time. Fortunately there are other guys picking up the slack for those of use who need a break. I know the feeling though.

Sometimes it is not even the questions, but those that ask questions and do not listen to the answers.

Lots of "experts" seem to join the forum these days.....

Why doesn't my razor pass the hanginh hair test? Is it because I tape the spine while honing? The razor in question is a vintage Gold Dollar I bought on Ebay.

Sorry. I couldn't resist the opportunity.

Originally Posted by Theseus

Why doesn't my razor pass the hanginh hair test? Is it because I tape the spine while honing? The razor in question is a vintage Gold Dollar I bought on Ebay.

Sorry. I couldn't resist the opportunity.

(I laughed my a$$ off at this one )

I think the Wiki is pretty straightforward as far as standard information. Most answers could be found there. There are however, a good amount of variable questions that need to be asked on the forums.

Guilty as charged

But consider that many of us are full grown men, who think highly of ourselves and our intelligence, and get embarrassed when our newbee questions are approached in ways that might make us feel insecure about asking, or group us in with every newbee that ever signed onto SRP.

For instance, my first ever post, when I explained that I had a brand spanking new, "shave ready" dovo that gave me 2-3 decent shaves before starting to pull, and that 200 featherlight strokes on a 8,000 grit stone did nothing but polish the bevel and did nothing to increase the sharpness, it would be difficult to know exactly what the problem was for anybody wishing to give advice.
However,
When approached with this problem, the answers I got were this:

"Learn to shave first, and take your razor to get honed by someone who knows what they're doing"

"consult the wiki and watch the instructional video"

"(insert multiple links from wiki to answer question)"

"you're not stropping properly"

"you're honing wrong and dulling the edge, or putting too much pressure"

"Don't try to learn how to hone and shave at the same time"

"you're holding the razor at the wrong angle"

When I suggested that maybe dovo didn't do a great job honing, I got this:

"So, you think the guys that sharpen razors for a living didn't sharpen your razor correctly, right?"

and

"How did you get 2-3 good shaves if they didn't set the bevel?"

Now, i've been a woodworker since high school, spent several years doing chip carving as a hobby, and honing my knives on 1,000 and 2,000 grit stones to perfect result for my purpose, and i watched every instructional video on razors and read everything I could find about honing razors BEFORE ever asking questions on SRP. I bought a 3 inch wide finishing hone so I could ensure proper form and use a 2 handed, modified push stroke so i could keep the entire length of the blade on the hone and push it forward without x strokes and without taking the edge off the stone and without putting pressure on the blade.

When I explained this, I still got the same answers, many repeated, probably because some posters didnt read the entire thread.

..Well, As it turned out, dovo didnt adequately set the bevel, but somehow sharpened it to a weak (but sharp) edge, which wore out quickly, and once I did a simple pyramid the shaver worked fine, even better than when I got it.


Can you see how someone might feel when we encounter a problem and get those answers every time, because everyone assumes we're totally clueless?

Originally Posted by daflorc

For instance, my first ever post, when I explained that I had a brand spanking new, "shave ready" dovo that gave me 2-3 decent shaves before starting to pull, and that 200 featherlight strokes on a 8,000 grit stone did nothing but polish the bevel and did nothing to increase the sharpness, it would be difficult to know exactly what the problem was for anybody wishing to give advice.
However,
When approached with this problem, the answers I got were this:

"Learn to shave first, and take your razor to get honed by someone who knows what they're doing"

"consult the wiki and watch the instructional video"

"(insert multiple links from wiki to answer question)"

"you're not stropping properly"

"you're honing wrong and dulling the edge, or putting too much pressure"

"Don't try to learn how to hone and shave at the same time"

"you're holding the razor at the wrong angle"

When I suggested that maybe dovo didn't do a great job honing, I got this:

"So, you think the guys that sharpen razors for a living didn't sharpen your razor correctly, right?"

and

"How did you get 2-3 good shaves if they didn't set the bevel?"

Now, i've been a woodworker since high school, spent several years doing chip carving as a hobby, and honing my knives on 1,000 and 2,000 grit stones to perfect result for my purpose, and i watched every instructional video on razors and read everything I could find about honing razors BEFORE ever asking questions on SRP. I bought a 3 inch wide finishing hone so I could ensure proper form and use a 2 handed, modified push stroke so i could keep the entire length of the blade on the hone and push it forward without x strokes and without taking the edge off the stone and without putting pressure on the blade.

When I explained this, I still got the same answers, many repeated, probably because some posters didnt read the entire thread.

..Well, As it turned out, dovo didnt adequately set the bevel, but somehow sharpened it to a weak (but sharp) edge, which wore out quickly, and once I did a simple pyramid the shaver worked fine, even better than when I got it.


Can you see how someone might feel when we encounter a problem and get those answers every time, because everyone assumes we're totally clueless?

I posted in your thread as well. I was confused because you gave me the impression that your razor was professionally honed. You meant: it was honed by DOVO, I got the impression it was honed by a honemeister. 2nd is that apparently (I did not know this) DOVO hone their razors in a funny way with the spine off the hone. As soon as you start to hone you first have to reset the bevel.

It is always hard to assess a problem from a distance without seeing the razor and how the newb hones, strops and shaves. That's why you may get answers that don't help your particular problems. The commonest problems are usually addressed 1st by those trying to help.