Thread: Williams is great soap!

OK, I did not suffer blunt trauma to the head...I still depise the Williams you can currently get. That stuff is as poor a performer as I have tried.

However, it was not always this way!

Once upon a time, Williams was indeed a high quality soap. Rich, creamy lather, great cushion, good glide. Tallowy goodness. Really, it is (or rather, was) good stuff.

I recieved this vintage puck from a benificent, and mysterious B&B member who sent it to me out of the blue (Thanks!)

So, for any of you who try to take comfort in the idea of using a soap "that's good enough to have been around 100 years"....well, think again, because the stuff you can get these days is nothing at all like the stuff that they used to make.

Coconut oil and KOH for softer soap must have made a luxurant lather.

Does the Williams today contain tallow?

The new stuff has Sodium Tallowate, but it's probably not as good as regular Tallow. Why fix what wasn't broken....

Originally Posted by Sticky

The new stuff has Sodium Tallowate, but it's probably not as good as regular Tallow. Why fix what wasn't broken....

Sodium Tallowate is just the product (i.e. the soap) that comes from mixing tallow and sodium hydroxide, no change here.

Originally Posted by fccexpert

Sodium Tallowate is just the product (i.e. the soap) that comes from mixing tallow and sodium hydroxide, no change here.

Since they are mixing the tallow with sodium hydroxide, that means there is indeed a change there, no? Certainly as far as quantities of the mixture goes?

All I can tell you is that there are miles of difference between the tallow first vintage stuff (excellent), and the sodium tallowate modern stuff (horrible).

Originally Posted by Seraphim

Since they are mixing the tallow with sodium hydroxide, that means there is indeed a change there, no? Certainly as far as quantities of the mixture goes?

All I can tell you is that there are miles of difference between the tallow first vintage stuff (excellent), and the sodium tallowate modern stuff (horrible).

If you mix tallow (a fat) with sodium hydroxide you will saponify the fat and form soap. The saponified tallow is often called sodium tallowate. This is not a true chemical name since each fat molecule consists of three (usually different) fatty acid chains combined with a single glycerine molecule, and a natural fat like tallow will contain several different fat molecules. Saponification produces three separate sodium salts (one from each fatty acid) plus glycerine.

Tallow typically contains the following fatty acid chains:

Palmitic acid
Stearic acid
Myristic acid
Oleic acid
Palmitoleic acid
Linoleic acid
Linolenic acid

Thus a full listing of all of the salts in a soap made from tallow would be:

Sodium Plamate
Sodium Stearate
Sodium Myristate
Sodium Oleiate
Sodium Palmtoleate
Sodium Linoleate
Sodium Linolenate

Sodium Tallowate is just a commercial abreviation for these chemicals.

Why the modern Williams is does not work as well as the old stuff certainly has something to do with its formulations, but it is not because Sodium Tallowate was substituted for Tallow and Sodium Hydroxide.



It is highly unlikely that the old Williams soap contains any significant unreacted sodium hydroxide (lye) since this would make the material very basic, and this would cause it to burn your skin. It may contain unreacted tallow if this was added as a super fat.

I find the current Williams provides a great cushioning lather. This is what works well for me NB I have hard water too.

Cover the soap cake with hot tap water while I shower, i put my brush in the bowl too. With the shower over & done with, I drain off the water from the brush & cake. I then load the brush with product. I rinse my face with hot water & face lather ....you will tell when it is right, it is thick n creamy & has that sheen to it

Brush (s) I use Semogue 1305, 620 or 1470 all boars with a 50 -55mm loft.

Originally Posted by Fozz7769

I find the current Williams provides a great cushioning lather. This is what works well for me NB I have hard water too.

Cover the soap cake with hot tap water while I shower, i put my brush in the bowl too. With the shower over & done with, I drain off the water from the brush & cake. I then load the brush with product. I rinse my face with hot water & face lather ....you will tell when it is right, it is thick n creamy & has that sheen to it

Brush (s) I use Semogue 1305, 620 or 1470 all boars with a 50 -55mm loft.

May I ask what other soaps you have tried?

Yes, you can.

Not is any particular order....

Proraso
Omega
Wool Fat
Kells Originals
Ems Soap rounds
L'Occitane
Williams
Palmolive
Arko
La Toja
Speick