Thread: Da - BOMB cream?

Originally Posted by BeBerlin

As always, different strokes... I have tried two, and they were very nice. For artisan products, they are indeed outstanding. That said, they are not the very best I have tried. And being a subscriber to the beginners-should-get-the-best-they-can in the pre shave preparation department, I would beg to differ with respect to this round-robin recommendation - albeit slightly.

Regards,
Robin

That just does not make sense to me. Why make the best the enemy of the good, especially for people new to wet-shaving? Are you honestly saying that a beginner should spend rather large (and in some cases superfluous sums of money on a product the quality of which they have no means of appreciating? By that rationale, a new driver should learn to operate a clutch on a Ferrari, or a toddler should learn to read by starting with Shakespeare or Goethe.

If I were a beginner, I doubt your advice would encourage me. Rather, it would make me think straight-shaving is an elite and well to-do club whose ranks were not open to me. Yet is not the point precisely the opposite?

My apologies if I diverted the thread needlessly.

Originally Posted by Gldbird1

By that rationale, a new driver should learn to operate a clutch on a Ferrari, or a toddler should learn to read by starting with Shakespeare or Goethe.

You can't ruin cream as you would a car, and it's easier to produce good lather from better products so your second analogy doesn't relate (to me it seems backwards, actually). Using the best products possible makes learning to shave easier, so yes, I agree that it is worth it to get the best you can in order to minimize frustrations and ease the learning curve as much as possible.

Originally Posted by holli4pirating

You can't ruin cream as you would a car, and it's easier to produce good lather from better products so your second analogy doesn't relate (to me it seems backwards, actually). Using the best products possible makes learning to shave easier, so yes, I agree that it is worth it to get the best you can in order to minimize frustrations and ease the learning curve as much as possible.

Sure you can; you waste it, which is exactly what is done if a) you learn to lather using a very expensive cream, and/or b) you choose based on no sense or experience of what constitutes "goodness." The second analogy holds in exactly that way - the beginner is not yet in a position to appreciate what distinguishes the best from the very good or even the simply sufficient, which means whatever makes something the "best" is completely lost on him or her.

All I am trying to say is that beginners seem best served by starting moderately - with middle-of-the-road products that perform well - and then moving up to better and more expensive versions when they can more fully appreciate them. Doing the opposite seems to me to feed on too many of the fears beginners have, and hence increases their chances of quitting too soon.

Originally Posted by Gldbird1

All I am trying to say is that beginners seem best served by starting moderately - with middle-of-the-road products that perform well - and then moving up to better and more expensive versions when they can more fully appreciate them. Doing the opposite seems to me to feed on too many of the fears beginners have, and hence increases their chances of quitting too soon.

And this is where we will simply have to agree to disagree. 10 of my friends started with CF by my recommendation, and 5 stuck with it. The others moved on to less expensive creams, making an informed decision because they had experienced what the de facto standard should be.

You know, it's a bit like starting with a razor that was honed by a honemeister. Sure, you can start with a razor honed by one of the many honesters, skimping on the fee, and ending up with something that is a middle-of-the-road product that might perform well. But is that really something you would recommend? NB, Al is not a honester, and his creams perform very well. I was referring to your argument only.

Regards,
Robin

Originally Posted by Gldbird1

Sure you can; you waste it, which is exactly what is done if a) you learn to lather using a very expensive cream, and/or b) you choose based on no sense or experience of what constitutes "goodness." The second analogy holds in exactly that way - the beginner is not yet in a position to appreciate what distinguishes the best from the very good or even the simply sufficient, which means whatever makes something the "best" is completely lost on him or her.

Waste - how much excess lather to you rinse off your brush and out of your bowl at the end of every shave? Or do you save it? Cause you can.

b) You're right that new guys won't know what is good on their own, so they rely on others experiences of what is good. This, as Robin said, sets a benchmark for what the word "excellent" means, not to mention it aims to remove one variable from the process. Robin's honing analogy is very successful here.

Second analogy - You don't necessarily have to appreciate something in contrast to inferior products to appreciate how good it is. While one may appreciate delicious food differently if they are forced to eat bad food, they will still appreciate delicious food if it is all they ever eat, and the person will still know it is delicious, too.

Originally Posted by holli4pirating

Waste - how much excess lather to you rinse off your brush and out of your bowl at the end of every shave? Or do you save it? Cause you can.

b) You're right that new guys won't know what is good on their own, so they rely on others experiences of what is good. This, as Robin said, sets a benchmark for what the word "excellent" means, not to mention it aims to remove one variable from the process. Robin's honing analogy is very successful here.

Second analogy - You don't necessarily have to appreciate something in contrast to inferior products to appreciate how good it is. While one may appreciate delicious food differently if they are forced to eat bad food, they will still appreciate delicious food if it is all they ever eat, and the person will still know it is delicious, too.

Really? If all things are delicious then no thing is delicious because everything is the same, i.e., without distinction, i.e., bland. Every distinction presupposes an opposite: good/bad, beautiful/ugly, noble/base. You may disagree, but the burden of proof is on you - how would you know that delicious foods remain delicious in the best of all worlds?

I think of shaving creams much like wine; a beginner is simply wasting money starting with an elegant Bordeaux. You have to learn to appreciate finer things, which means you start simply and sufficiently and work your way up.

Sorry, this is fun, but maybe we should stop. The thread was, after all, about The Bomb.

Originally Posted by Gldbird1

Really? If all things are delicious then no thing is delicious because everything is the same, i.e., without distinction, i.e., bland. Every distinction presupposes an opposite: good/bad, beautiful/ugly, noble/base.

That kind of Machiavellian philosophy went out of style somewhere around the Humanist Enlightenment.

Originally Posted by BKratchmer

That kind of Machiavellian philosophy went out of style somewhere around the Humanist Enlightenment.

Machiavelli? Not quite; regard for the difference between the noble and the base is characteristic of Socratic philosophy (ton agathon + ton kalon), not Machiavelli's. Machiavelli's teaching is distinctive in its regard for the "effectual truth" (Il Principe, chp. XV). In this respect, the Enlightenment derives from Machiavelli, not in contradistinction to him.

To BeBerlin and Holli: this is fun and all, but shall we continue in another thread? Or maybe by PM. We've really high-jacked this thread, which is unfair to AlRaz.

Originally Posted by Gldbird1

Really? If all things are delicious then no thing is delicious because everything is the same, i.e., without distinction, i.e., bland. Every distinction presupposes an opposite: good/bad, beautiful/ugly, noble/base. You may disagree, but the burden of proof is on you

Yes, all comparison's are relative, that is the very nature of "comparison." But that does not mean someone will not know whether something is pleasing or not, and it does not mean someone who has never tired shaving cream will not appreciate a great cream more than he will appreciate a good cream simply because he has used the great one but not the good one. Better is better, whether you have a frame of reference or not, and you don't need a frame of reference to enjoy the benefits of a great cream over a good cream. All you won't know or enjoy is how much better the great stuff is compared to the good stuff.

There is nothing to prove, this is my world view and yours is clearly different. I'm not trying to push my view onto you or anyone else, so I'll just leave it at that.

Hey all,

I have the Cedar version of the Bomb myself, so I just wanted to point out a few things from my personal experience that don't seem to have been mentioned so far yet in this thread. If that have been and I just missed it, my apologies.

It was mentioned before the the Bomb comes in a 4 fl. oz. container. This is entirely true, but it's worth mentioning that the cream is pretty dense. So you actually get something more than 4 avoirdupois ounces of cream. A little goes an exceptionally long way. As I've used a fair amount of mine, I can't tell you exactly what the weight was when I bought it, but it's just a bit under four oz. right now. So, I think it's somewhat unfair to compare fl. oz. here. Sort of an apples-and-oranges comparison.

Also useful to note--the Bomb has something like 16 available scents from which to choose. It might even be more. I can't, off the top of my head, think of another shaving cream or soap that's going to offer you that much variety. You can, to my understanding, even mix and match the scents of your choosing. That's certainly not something I've experienced before. So, god forbid, if you want to mix your cedar with almond you can do it.

It's also a fair point that the soap is not cheap. Few good things are, except maybe KFC. But you're not going to pay any shipping anywhere in the U.S. It ships priority to you without your paying a cent for the shipping. So, all things considered above, I think the price is very difficult to beat.

That's just my few cents' worth. I hope everything finds you all well.

SuS