Thread: Stropping is King

Originally Posted by PuFFaH

How will you monitor Scotts stropping? Is it on trust or scientific analysys of the razors edge to see if abrasives were used?

I accept Scott's word, and I'm sure Ilija will too.

I'm sorry but I feel Scott is getting a rough ride over what was only a man passing on a "TIP" that others could choose to emulate or dissregard as they see fit. If Scott claims to only use a plain leather strop to strop with and only use a hone every 6 mths or so, then I for one do not disspute this. If I did, I would set the challenge for my self to try and achieve the same result to prove or disprove one way or the other.

Scott is providing a scientific specimen. I claim I can't generate one and he claims he can, so who should be providing it?

Why are you reading an insult into this? If I disbelieved Scott I would ignore the whole thing. Simply because he didn't put something on the strop doesn't mean it hasn't gotten there over 10 years use. A neew strop of a different kind woulld present a much better specimen if he could succeed with it. The only thing it takes out of the picture is his strop being responsible for the results.

I too rarely hone but rely on pasted strops to refresh my blades.

As far as I'm concerned, that takes you out of the picture, because you don't do anything different than I do. If you come back in six months and tell us that you still have a keen edge and haven't refreshed the razor, we'll have something to talk about.

Any test you set up will only serve to confuse the issue on technicalities of opinion.

Yeah, why confuse things with objective facts?

The test if there should be one would best be served if carried out by Lynn on his own equipment and Tony the same.

Are you forgetting that Scott has the special skill?

Or do you just claim Scott has abrasive on his strop? If so, the only way around this is for Scott to send his strop off to be evaluated.
All very good, but, is Scott on trial for heracy?

And what would we test for? Do you have any idea how much of what would be enough? Why all this talk of trail and persecuting Scott? What gives? We're trying to set up an experiment to figure this thing out.

I hate to see you going off in a huff (or should I say puff?), but I think it's entirely unjustified.

[quote=honedright;75328]

I have no problem with this.

I didn't think you would, and I'm eager to get started. THis experiment could be very valuable.

Can I re-hone the razor at the start if think it needs it? Or does this trial require that I use it "as is" from Lynn? (Assuming Lynn wants to go along with this).

I think you must start with a keen razor, but I don't care how it gets that way. All that's important is that Lynn tells us at the end if the razor is keen.

I think we came to a point of collecting the materials and the experts, with one addition to the terms. I propose that the 2 strops and the 2 razors should be given away to newbs after the experiment.

Originally Posted by urleebird

Ilija... wait...

• What makes your skepticism... scientific?
• Against whos tonsorial tradition? Are you qualified to speak for all barbers? Careful, now...
• Whos accumulated experience? I believe both these guys, and it's not the first time I have heard/read about this method of keeping a razor sharp. Sounds like they also have experience to me.

I know you have heard the expression, "There's more than one way to skin a cat." So, just because you haven't experienced the same result, perhaps without even trying it first, yourself, it doesn't mean it isn't so.

I don't remember anyone saying that a hone doesn't work to keep a razor sharp. They are just saying it not as necessary if you don't want it to be. At least, that's my interpretation.

We are not skeptical about the result. We accept it, and I accept Scott at his word, or I wouldn't have proposed that he do his thing and we accept that the edge was never exposed to an abrasive other than the plain strop.

The question we're trying answer is whether a razor can be maintained indefinitely with a normal leather strop only with a typical number of reps (40) per shave. If you have seen that proven, I would be very interested. Everything I've ever seen says you need to at least refresh occasionally. We're not talking about a hone, because using a pasted strop is also refreshing.

If we can show that, it would be a great contribution to sharpening science. Scott has done it, but we believe there's something on the strop (a trace). If he can do it with a new strop, it's a real accomplishent. Contrary to what's been said, I don't doubt Scott's results, I'm entirely willing to take his word on what he does. We just have different theories on the cause, and the experiment will resolve them.

Originally Posted by Joe Lerch

I think you're missing my point. You seem to agree with me that you need the "odd refresh." So you're not doing it just with plain leather. That's all I said. I never said you must use a hone. I do exactly what you do, but I refresh with a fine hone.

Look Joe, Scott has said he refreshes on a hone every 6 mths or so, I say i refresh on a pasted hanging strop every 6mths to a year. I fail to see where me and Scott differ except by our means of refreshing the razor. You say you do the same as us, so why are you still contradicting this?

PuFF

And Joe, maybe you would send me one of your razors and (now this might sound gross) some of your scalp hairs (I promise I won't make a voodoo doll with them) so that we can see if I can't just get your razor to pass the HHT with your hair. You claim you can't do it. Want to see if I can?

Are you game?

Scott

Originally Posted by Joe Lerch

In fact, I'm taking his word for the RESULT. I just disagree with his assumed EXPLANATION. That's not calling him a liar. But you have even less reason for accepting his explanation, because you refresh your razor, admitting that a leather strop alone won't do it.

I already achieve what you can, but can you achieve what Scott does- no refreshing?

That's what I plan to do, but I want to use a normal strop that works for him. That's the reason for my offer. I'm sure hiis method has merit, because it works. I'm just trying to find out what it is, and if it requires a strop in a special condition.

You are incorrect again. I do the same as Scott but i use a pasted hanging strop where Scott uses a hone every 6 mths or so. Also you say you do the same, hmmm confused.

PuFF

Originally Posted by FiReSTaRT

I think we came to a point of collecting the materials and the experts, with one addition to the terms. I propose that the 2 strops and the 2 razors should be given away to newbs after the experiment.

I want one change. Assuming we have one strop that satisfies the experiment, I will reimburse Scott and would like to have it to experiment with. That was one of the motivations for my proposing an experiment. If one did and one didn't, that could be very telling, and we might want to keep them for further experimentation.

There may be a small problem. Since Scott will know he's part of an experiment, his behavior/technique may change. I think the best way to eliminate this bias would be for someone to sneak into Scott's house, switch two of his razors and two strops, leave them for a certain amount of time, then sneak back in, switch the items back, and finally have an outside party test those razors. A blindfold might help too, but that could get a little dangerous.
On a serious note, whoever tests the razors at the end should have other razors thrown into the mix and not know which are from Scott.

Originally Posted by PuFFaH

Look Joe, Scott has said he refreshes on a hone every 6 mths or so, I say i refresh on a pasted hanging strop every 6mths to a year. I fail to see where me and Scott differ except by our means of refreshing the razor. You say you do the same as us, so why are you still contradicting this?

PuFF

I referesh about every other week.