Thread: SRD & OTHER DIAMOND SPRAYS! Comparisons.

Hello all, long time since I've dropped in. Still using glasstones, leather, nylon webbing, and I've been playing with velcro....yeah velcro...but back to the question.

I'm looking at all the diamond spray options on the market. (Pastes are out for certain reasons).

There is oil based, there's water based...then there is monocrystalline and polycrystalline.

Does anyone know if the SRD is mono or poly? I'm sure they chose whichever one they deemed better for use with straight razors...but I have a slightly different application in mind and I need/want poly.

I have found several sources but I'd rather buy 4oz @ 15carat than 8 or 16oz at some unknown concentration.

I have to assume it's monocrystalline since it isn't a dark suspension. But I know the SRD boys could easily have an ace up their sleeve.

Thoughts? I've read all the techie junk and computer readouts...any real-world comparisons of mono vs. poly.

The backing is still up in the air, but it will likely be felt or wool used on stainless steel 57-63HRC.

I can't help you with the SRD issue but to me the really important thing with diamond media which you didn't ask is how good the sorting is. The other stuff is minor to me.

I'd have to agree fully with that. I've forgotten the lesson I learned the hard way about CrOx. A year or two ago I was getting frustrated...then found that the stuff I was using was half aluminum oxide and was screen through a ????? mesh that "could" have let stuff as big as 45 microns through!!!!!!!!!

It does wonders for a knife on paper wheels, but I bought some Hand American CrOx and it was whole different game from there on.

Does anyone know of sources that DO have substandard sorting? You can PM me if you don't want to publicly call a company out.

I'm sure the SRD is top-shelf stuff, and it's priced well against the industrial stuff I can find. That's why I'd like to use it, but others in this venture are using poly and swear buy it.

Trying to avoid buying a bunch of different kinds and ending up with 4oz of diamond I can use and a half gallon of stuff I can't!!!!! (That'll get expensive!)

I have now idea what diamond srd is using.if i havent tottaly loose my back knowledge mono means =one.poly=many could be 1.2.3.4.etc. Now what confuses me is this .do you think if it is poly then diamonds contominated with something else? Or it is just same crystals joint together? Lets say .25 is mono and .5 is poly.this question is come up first time .would you explain alittle more? Thank you

I've asked Don to check with our Chemist on this. I don't have a clue other than the diamond goes through some kind of stabilization process and is limited to 15 carat as we are told that any more than that is over kill and can actually have a negative impact. There is also a similar process for the CrOx. I believe we were the first to involve the use of a chemist in making our products specifically for straight razor honing vs. mixing it in the basement so to speak........lol.

The first diamond spray I ever used was from GRS and it worked OK. The solution had more a chemical odor to it and I believe it was 6 carats. Hep Hep, is there a scientist in da house......

I normally do 10 X strokes on .5 diamond spray on felt as the final process in my everyday honing and virtually every edge ends up spot on for the shave test. Occasionally one will need a little more tinkering. The most important aspect to me is that it works very well and is consistent.

By the way, if you are really looking at them all, you can report on them all for us. What application will it be used on??

All the best,

Lynn

I don't know a micron from a mountain but IME the SRD diamond spray works really well on the SRD felt hanging strop.

Originally Posted by hi_bud_gl

I have now idea what diamond srd is using.if i havent tottaly loose my back knowledge mono means =one.poly=many could be 1.2.3.4.etc. Now what confuses me is this .do you think if it is poly then diamonds contominated with something else? Or it is just same crystals joint together? Lets say .25 is mono and .5 is poly.this question is come up first time .would you explain alittle more? Thank you

Everything I know about this question I learned from the DMT website.

Originally Posted by Lynn

I've asked Don to check with our Chemist on this. I don't have a clue other than the diamond goes through some kind of stabilization process and is limited to 15 carat as we are told that any more than that is over kill and can actually have a negative impact. There is also a similar process for the CrOx. I believe we were the first to involve the use of a chemist in making our products specifically for straight razor honing vs. mixing it in the basement so to speak........lol.

I remember speaking with you about this one time. The term, correct me if I'm wrong, is colloidal suspension. This will allow the diamond to be even throughout the bottle and if the particles are too dense it will start to become too abrasive versus just "touching up" the edge. Thus the edge will deteriorate rapidly losing the fine edge that was acquired using a finishing hone.

I think that's right about our conversation about this.

hi_bud_gl: *IF I UNDERSTAND THIS ALL CORRECTLY*
Mono does allude to one/single and poly alludes to many...but it doesn't mean one crystal or many crystals. I refers to the structure of the individual diamond crystals. Monocrystalline diamonds look like much like salt under a microscope, they are very strong and you must "round off" the corners of the crystals before the cutting action is compromised. Polycrystalline diamonds look a little more like coc-ker burrs under a microscope. They *supposedly* cut more aggressively and leave a finer finish due to the fact that they aren't very strong and will crack/break/crush into smaller diamonds just like the grit on your Aluminum Oxide or Sil. Carbide sandpaper. Polycrystalline is usually black, and both kinds are/can be man-made.
Here's the snippet that I found was the most helpful:
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Lynn: The SRD 15carats is the highest concentration I've found. (By a pretty good margin too!) Most places don't list the carat...only the fl. ounces. Metallography, Gem Cutting, and whatever you call guys who build stone/marble floors and monuments is where I've found most sources. Many give the option of mono or poly. They don't provide any details on grading...and the liquid carrier varies widely.

I'm using it to sharpen professional high-end shears. It's going on a 6" disk that spins like an old lp table...at 700-1700rpm. One of my mentors uses 3mic poly spray on a piece of billiard table wool. His source only sells in 16oz quantities. That's $90 before shipping...and at $90 for each grit it's going to get very very expensive to try 3mic vs. 1mic vs. 1/2mic. I'm quite sure 1/2mic is overkill, as we still want the edge to have ever-so-slight of a bite to it so that the hair doesn't "push" out of shear tips.

Sil. Carbide, CBN and 3M Trizact are the common abrasives used before polishing/stropping/burnishing the edge. Usually they jump from 9mic to polish.


I'll throw another question out there:
3M diamond lapping films. Really Really thinking of trying the PSA backed on a slab of glass...lapping gets old really fast. How easily do they gouge? A colleague has somehow quantified that it takes 10-12# of downforce on the blade to get a proper honing on the inside of the blades. Any chance at all they'll work for something like that?


Saw a few guys using the Naniwa diamond stones at a recent convention, don't know how they compare to my glasstones as far as hardness. Any experience there? Should probably head over to the hone subforum for that.

Dang, that was long. Los sientos.

The two types are best used for different applications. The price isn't that much different. Advantages of the poly?


■Higher cutting rates
■Very uniform surface finish
■More uniform particle size distribution
■Higher removal rates (self sharpening abrasives)
■Harder/tougher particles
■Blocky shaped
■Hexagonal microcrystallites (equally hard in all directions)
■Extremely rough surface (more cutting points)
■Surface area 300% greater than monocrystalline diamond
■No abrasion-resistant directionality (abrasion independent of particle orientation)

Of course the poly wear much faster than the mono reason being the mono is one single xtl while the poly is made up of individual grains.