Thread: Strop material and draw

Hey guys so I am looking to buy a second strop I currently have an IL 827 Russian Leather that was/is my first strop so here's my question....

What types of leather create what draw? And is there any advantage more than personal preference in have a heavy, medium or light draw strop?

Thanks!

This has been discussed before, I'm sure of it. I've never used an illonios strop, so can't comment, but draw makes no difference to the stropped edge. Draw is just user preference.


Mick

yeah i tried a search a few times before posting the ? and found a bunch of stuff on draw and what it is but was unable to find what materials create what draw

I can tell you is Horse usually has little or no draw. Sometimes the surface treatment like certain dressings will increase draw in any strop. I can also tell you the latigo types have a lot of draw.

Having different strops helps me get a better edge simply because some razors feel better (to me) on different strops, and using the strop that feels best with a particular razor helps me to control my stropping strokes.
I have a Classic Shaving 2 inch latigo (heavy draw), an SRD III (pretty heavy), and an SRD IV (medium / smooth draw). Which one I use depends on which razor I want to shave with. I like a fair amount of draw, but not too much. Some razors feel too heavy on the latigo, and some feel too light on the SRD IV. It seems to depend on the shape of the razor.

Originally Posted by BenjamanBarker

yeah i tried a search a few times before posting the ? and found a bunch of stuff on draw and what it is but was unable to find what materials create what draw

I have looked for such a list and never found one.

In my limited experience light oils like Neatsfoot oil,
mineral oil and baseball glove oil reduce draw/drag.
Baseball glove oil is more "oil" than Neatsfoot I would
skip it... light oils are often wrong.

As the "oil" is removed over time drag increases
then the leather is polished and drag decreases.

Waxy leather dressings increase drag.
Mink oil increases drag for me if I use too
much. Scratch mink oil from the shopping list.

Pore fillers and filling processes decrease drag.
I have dusted a sticky strop with CeOx powder and the
drag was reduced. Some people even use clay
and graphite. Rubbing with lather and a bottle decreases
drag as the surface polishes.

I have a couple of "strop" dressings. One is apparently
tallow (40 years old) and increases drag almost perfectly.
Another is newer and may be an emulsion of neatsfoot oil,
mineral oil and something else. The new stuff is not too bad.
It is a bit more slippery (less drag). A good hand cream
or face cream might act the same.

The problem with any list is the most common strop dressing
products do not have an ingredient list.

All bets are off if you apply too much!

If you get too much on sometimes you can dust the leather
with talcum powder or even corn starch to
soak up the extra then scrape the surface clean.
Better is to just use the strop and wipe the razor
after stropping. A razor will pick up extra from
the surface and over time it will level out.

It is interesting that I have strop dressing in
a 2.5oz jar 40 years old. You do not need much....
All my experiments are in the last couple years
in an attempt to duplicate a strop lost in a move.

If you buy dry leather from Tandy to make a strop
you will need some neatsfoot or mineral oil but not
a lot. Dry leather will sharpen a razor... note how
the surface gets gray.

I recommend making a couple "Tandy" strops if you want
to tinker. Making my own, I have learned a lot... I do not advise
tinkering on a good well made new strop beyond the makers
recommendations. My tinkering has made me
appreciate the value of a well made strop.

If you put your hand on a glass window
and can see a hand print you have enough
natural oil to rub your strop to perfection.

Too much oil and the strop will stretch
and cup. Anything you do needs to be
a "surface" dressing.

Sorry for rambling...

I hate to disagree with Nifty, but in my experience any oil, once it has had an adequate amount of time to sink into the leather, increases draw. IN practice I have found that only very dense leathers that have little or no absorbency will become faster in draw with oil, and that is simply because the oil sits on the surface of the leather.

Oils and waxes are used in the tanning process, and even the simple act of stropping a razor on a strop with enough oil/wax in it will draw that oil/wax to the surface after enough time and increase the draw. However, as Nifty says, this is easily addressed. Sometimes, yu don't even have to use the strop at all to see this - a strop which has the correct blend of oils and waxes that will not migrate to the surface in an even, warm climate will show a crystalline-like deposit of oils and wax if exposed to a much colder temperature.

A dryish leather (small amount of oils/waxes in the tanning) will prove to be the most stable over time.

The reason a list is not really practical is that leather comes from an incredible amount of tanneries - and each has their own tanning process. The leathers they produce may have their generic names like latigo or bridle, but each will vary in its particular character.

Latigo is a good one to ponder about. Once, it was a very oily, stretchy leather, ideal for outdoor applications and not primarily intended for strop making. When people began to use it for strops more and more, the tanning process was revised by the tanners to make it less oily and fibrous, then it really caught on. However, the tanneries knee-jerk react to market forces and after some time the tanning process was altered so radically that the only latigo readily available was stiff, hard and incredibly tough - the old stuff could be cut with one pass of a sharp knife, the hard stuff took three or more passes and blunted the knife in the process. The difference in draw was incredible.

Bridle is another one that is subject to great differences in character and draw. Originally it was (and still is) intended as a rugged leather for horse accoutrements, capable of withstanding rain, damp, sweat and extremes of temperature. To enable it to do this, you have three choices - go for a hard tanning, add excess oil and a little wax, add excess wax and a little oil. consequently some bridle leathers are like card, some have such a copious amount of wax that you can scrape it off with your fingernail, some are so oily that you can scrape it with a bar and it oozes oil.

In short, how can you produce a table of draw for different leathers when one leather can have fast, medium or of high draw?

Regards,
Neil

One must learn what different types of leather draw differently as well as what treatment the leather has been subjected to. How a strop is tanned can have a great effect. Oils and waxes as well as conditioners may be applied by the tannery or the maker/previous owner. If I may suggest, Give Neil Miller a shout. He is super knowledgeable in this regard. I aquired 5 different types on leather from him and each has it's own personality. Oh, Hi Neal!

I have the SRD modular paddle. There are three (if you exclude the 'rough') choices of leather for it. It comes with Premium 1, and you can get Premium 4 English bridal, and Horeside. With these options, how would you rate each for draw? If you wished to modify the draw, more or less, for them what would you recommend for treatments (if any) be?

Originally Posted by DovoDonut

I have the SRD modular paddle. There are three (if you exclude the 'rough') choices of leather for it. It comes with Premium 1, and you can get Premium 4 English bridal, and Horeside. With these options, how would you rate each for draw? If you wished to modify the draw, more or less, for them what would you recommend for treatments (if any) be?

Get a variety and use them each equally for a year and then revisit the topic of modifying the draw.
If you read back in this thread a strop maker corrected me and he was absolutely correct.
Time is a critical aspect in the strop game. Anything you notice this week will be different
in six months.

The strops of all types from SRD are very interesting because replacing damaged is easy and inexpensive
compared to a new strop.

As for strop dressing the best I ever found was purchased c.1972 and the 3oz jar is still
half full. It does not take much which is a good thing because I have found none like
it since.