Thread: How to stop cure the celluloid rot disease... Info Please!!!

How to stop cure the celluloid rot disease... Info Please!!!

In a recently acquired "bucket of rust" that I salvaged from a local junkyard, several of the "toasted" str8s had the unmistakeable pattern of pitting and oxidation caused by the decomposition of their celluloid scales.

Obviusly the first thing to do is separate the scales from the blade and isolate the "suffering" and thusly "afflicted" scales way from all other str8s in your collection.

Is there any way to "arrest", "contain" or "cure" the scales?

Also is there any method to treat the blade so that it remains "protected" and "immunized" from the acid gases caused by the decomposing celluloid scales...

Thanks in advance!

Tony

I wish I knew the answer!
From what I can tell, or have found looking for this same answer myself, the best way is to not cause the initial degradation. Colored celluloid is less likely to degrade, versus clear celluloid. However, it seems that with time almost all celluloid will degrade. If the scales are degrading, remove them and throw them away. Keep the blades clean by coating them in a protective oil (mineral oil, camelia oil, etc...).

Extreme heat or chemicals are a sure way to cause celluloid to degrade.

IF you do come across a solution, please post it here!!

Good luck,
C utz

Celluloid rot is oxidizing reaction and it is impossible to stop it. Ditch the scales, and clean the blade. The only way.

Nenad

I'm looking at some possible alternative strategies for dealling with celluloid rot.

1.) containment. It's worth investing in a few sets of "rotting" scales to see if coating the scales with CA, or some other plastic lacquer/paint coating that might "seal" the celluloid and stop the oxidising and breakdown of the celluloid.

It may require the removal of the most damaged and decomposed parts of the scales. However if only a light sanding is required and the building up of a few coats of CA to "save" a set of scales, then it might be worth the experimenting. Has anyone tried this strategy yet?

2.) Replacement. Make a silicone rubber mold from the original, cast a "replica" in epoxy or polyester or acrylic and transfer whatever inlays, bolsters, etc. from the original to the replica, as per how Vladsh transfered his DD bolsters and inlays onto a set of WOODEN replica scales of yellowheart (very, very, schweeeeet!) on his DD Goldedge or Wonderedge (I forgot which).

As a "not-for-profit research project", I'd be willing to make silicone rubber molds of any ailing scales.

As an open offer to the STR8 Razor community, I'd be willing to make silicone rubber molds for the follwing most problematic scales. There are probably other "problem" scales out there, but these seem to be the most commonly complained about. If you have other "problem" scales please let me know about them as well, and I'll see what I can do to be helpful to you.

DD SatinEdge
DD GoldEdge
DD WonderEdge
DD Dwarf

OR

Any "carved" or "scuplted", or "figured" scales.

My hunch is that the scales that are most likely to "break down" and decompose will be those sets of "CLEAR" or "CRACKED ICE" or "MOP" style scales with inlays and bolsters...as that would tend to be the most unstable type of cellulose formula.

So here's my open invitation to the community...

Contact me via PM, with your contact info and then we'll discuss your scales...

Once we've agreed to proceed, you can send me the scales, I'll make a mold from your original scales, cast a replica in epoxy, polyester, or acrylic,, I'll return the original scales to you plus one set of replica scales. Gratis....

Once, I get this project a little bit more organized, we could approach other "problematic" brands and types of scales as well...

I hope that my offer is helpful to members of the Str8 Razor community.

Tony

Typically MOP like and Pearlex/Cracked Ice scales are not what would have been considered as celluloid. The old pre-bakelite celluloid was a very thin material, not at all like DD scales or the ones you are mentioning. It is also rare to find real celluloid scales still around in decent shape.

Have fun on this interesting "Project"

Lynn

Celluloid decomposes a lot faster when it is stored in an enclosed place (the volatile gases given off will turn around and attack the remaining celluloid) -- perhaps just keeping it out so it can "breathe" will arrest the problem.

The celluloid pickguards on old archtop guitars used to do this when the guitars were stored in their cases for a long time.

I just spoke with a plastics expert who has studied celluloid and celluloid restoration. The opinion was that celluloid is inherently an unstable composition and once the polymer chain starts to unravel there's not much you can do but get out of the way.

She has tried different types of restoration techniques, sometimes they work, yet celluloid is so unstable, that sometimes the celluloid artifact decomposes right before your eyes.

She alswo warned that the chemical composition of decomposing celluloid gets awfully close to nitro cellulose explosives... so it's a really smart move to get everything valuable out of the way!

The decomposition is an inherently internal process so coating the scales with anything (CA) may help temporarily and even slow down the deterioration, but more than likely won't affect the process of decompostion in the long term.

She thought that my suggested process of making a mold of the original and casting a replica the best and most practical long term solution

Oh well....

Molds anyone?

Tony