Thread: How did barbers hone a wedge in the olden days?

Originally Posted by S0LITARYS0LDIER

Who gives a sh*t. Honestly it doesn't matter how they get flat. I thought this thread was how did barbers hone a wedge back in the day not how to get a stone flat...

Actually part of the conversation was that people didn't Flatten Hones back in the day and some discussion about how they did it...

So the concept was on topic but yes it has gone way out there now


BTW these rants sometimes produce actual proof on concepts somebody might actually take two-three hones and try the whole thing

This is great, guys! I can see rubbing A and B on the curved side for long enough to get them both reasonably flat, as long as full strokes are used with some variations and both hones are close in hardness and grit. However, as the peaks hit the valleys, the valleys get worn, which is opposite of the desired outcome as the valleys should be preserved. It's the peaks we want to rid ourselves of. Unless some interesting figure 8's are employed, one, or both of the hones will be subjected to a great deal of wear. This is dependent upon which hone is hardest, of course.
With 3 hones, one should rub the 2 softer ones on the backside of the hardest to get things closer in regards to the peaks while avoiding the valleys. Then, the two could be rubbed together until evenly matched, given both would yield to the process. Then, the two flattened in this manner, would be used to team-up on the harder one. An unending cycle?
If one is much harder and will not be effected by the other, I cannot see how it would ever work.
Might do well to take them all out to the sidewalk and begin there!

Tom

They are talking about using three of the same hones

Which was another reason why I said this was not important in regards to SR honing the last two times it came up we don't often own three of the same even those of us with HAD

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Tom

They are talking about using three of the same hones

Which was another reason why I said this was not important in regards to SR honing the last two times it came up we don't often own three of the same even those of us with HAD

OH!.............. That makes it even more great!

Barber A sez 'Man! My hone is gettin dished. It's a Coti!'
Barber B sez "mine too! It's a Coti as well. Let's rub 'em together and get them flat!"
Barber C chimes in " Sorry guys, won't work unless you include my Coticule!"
Barbers A and B respond in unison....."WHY NOT?"

Originally Posted by gssixgun

So prove it,,, Smooth yes, Flat no.. especially over time the surfaces will go out of true flat, so show me a reference to what you claim...

Wait, I have to find a reference that you deem authoritative - that has the potential to end up as exercise in futility?
You've gotta straighten up your definitions first - 'smooth' and 'flat' are perhaps intuitive and meaningful for you, but you have to provide a measure to quantify them before you can step into 'mathematical proof' territory.

Here's the mathematical equation about the rate of abrasion (q is the generalized coordinate, theta is the tangent angle at the contact between the two surfaces that are being rubbed together, F is the normal force that holds the two surfaces together, mu is the coefficient of friction and A is a proportionality constant).

Since cos decreases from 1 as theta is increases from zero the rate of abrasion increases with the deviation from flat surface. It's a negative feedback driving the surface towards flat i.e. theta=0, then the rate of abrasion becomes constant irrespective of q and the surface remains flat.

Originally Posted by S0LITARYS0LDIER

Who gives a sh*t. Honestly it doesn't matter how they get flat. I thought this thread was how did barbers hone a wedge back in the day not how to get a stone flat...

Dunno, somebody seems to care a lot about being right about things they don't quite understand. I'm more than happy to provide backing for my statements when challenged as I'm used to that.

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Tom

They are talking about using three of the same hones

Which was another reason why I said this was not important in regards to SR honing the last two times it came up we don't often own three of the same even those of us with HAD

If I had two of the same grit naniwas I'd have already posted pictures of how they get flat by rubbing them together
(1) draw a pencil grid on each
(2) run them over the DMT to show they are not flat (grids are gone in few places only)
(3) rub them together until they are flat
(4) redraw pencil grids on both again
(5) run them over the DMT to prove they are flat now (the grids are gone completely in a couple of strokes)

But I only have one of each 1k,5k,8k,16k and it will wear too much stone and take too much time to get two of them that are so dissimilar flat (it still works but wears out a lot from the softer hone).

I'd love for someone to challenge me on something I know,,,, I just can't think of anything to suggest for them,,,

Originally Posted by Hirlau

I'd love for someone to challenge me on something I know,,,, I just can't think of anything to suggest for them,,,

I know the feeling, John!

Originally Posted by gugi

If I had two of the same grit naniwas I'd have already posted pictures of how they get flat by rubbing them together
(1) draw a pencil grid on each
(2) run them over the DMT to show they are not flat (grids are gone in few places only)
(3) rub them together until they are flat
(4) redraw pencil grids on both again
(5) run them over the DMT to prove they are flat now (the grids are gone completely in a couple of strokes)

But I only have one of each 1k,5k,8k,16k and it will wear too much stone and take too much time to get two of them that are so dissimilar flat (it still works but wears out a lot from the softer hone).

So. If the 3rd hone is a DMT, It works a champ, wastes a lot of the other 2!!

Originally Posted by Hirlau

I'd love for someone to challenge me on something I know,,,, I just can't think of anything to suggest for them,,,

Perhaps rubbing the two round-ish stones together while running?