Split from all the Coticule threads:::

[Lynn]

Awesome, Lynn! In your opinion, of all the stones you tried it with, which would you grab if someone forced your hand to use this method again?

Tough question. The Coticule, Escher and Thuringen produced pretty similar results with a few variations in the number of strokes or times to the hone. I did like the Escher results the best, but not the most common stone out there. I would probably use either of them as I wouldn't want to subject my Nakayama to this kind of abuse all the time. It actually produced the best finished results.

Lynn

[gssixgun]

After the shave:

Here is the only way I can think to describe this, keep in mind I know this razor well it is one of my favs....

First to clear some things up I stopped right there no pastes no nothing I stropped it up on a SRD Premium I before the shave 50/100 just like i would any razor fresh off the hones...

I am going to compare this to a car I know well so I hope this makes sense...

This BB when tweaked out for me to shave with is a Mustang GT KR 500 HP all tweaked in the suspension

What I shaved with this morning is still a Mustang but more of a V-6 plain Jane version....

Same car they both get you there but one makes the drive much more exciting,, leaving a razor at this level would drive me nutz as I know there is way better....

Does it shave? yes, does it shave smoothly? yes, Could I shave with this all the time? yes, would I want better if I knew it was available? Hell yes

I guess what I am saying is I am not a minimalist at all when it comes to shaving with a straight I want the best, I pamper myself in this one thing, so cutting the corners on having the best stones out there just doesnt makes sense to me....

Time wise???? hmmmmmm good question this took 200 laps, I could have done it in 100 and had a better edge...

[hi_bud_gl]

..

,, leaving a razor at this level would drive me nutz as I know there is way better...

OHHH REALLLLY?

Great. Now i feel a lot better. thank You

[hi_bud_gl]

There are probably more rocks in hell though.

Been there and seen it. Their color black and very sharp edges. when hits hurts badly.hehehhehe

[JimmyHAD]

I guess what I am saying is I am not a minimalist at all when it comes to shaving with a straight I want the best, I pamper myself in this one thing, so cutting the corners on having the best stones out there just doesnt makes sense to me....

This reminds me of getting my favorite coticule. He isn't posting on SRP lately but for those of you who remember The Topher you'll recall that he knows his way around a razor hone. He lives near me (30 miles one way) and was sort of a honing mentor to me when I first came around. He bought an 8x3 natural from Howard to try a coticule out.

His usual routine had been the Norton 4/8 and finishing with a Shapton Pro 15k. He worked with the coticule on a few razors and shaved tested each of them. His conclusion was that he could get them sharp enough to shave but not "scary sharp" (his words) and that is what he preferred. So he offered me the stone for what he had in it and I bought it.

I found the edges that I got off of that stone to be just spiffy for me. I found razors that Chris (The Topher) honed to be almost too sharp for my taste. So some of us want that mustang with the tuned suspension while others want that falcon with the six cylinder and the stick on the column. (damn, I wish I had one of those now)

[gssixgun]

I need to clarify here guys, as I can see a trend...

There is a difference in smoothness not sharpness per se...

I have said this numerous times here

approximate grits to do things on a blade
below 1k = damage repair
1k-3k = bevel set
3k-6k = sharpen
7k-10k = polish
above 10k = finish

All you are doing here is using the slurry to make a combo hone on one stone nothing more nothing less...

If you are talking in engineering terms yes I might get a few microns more out of the edge by using a finisher or pastes but more than that, I am going to get smoothness....
At a 4k level regardless of stone, slurry, or magic dust, you are pretty much at the sharpness level you need to be at, after that you are polishing and smoothing the edge.... This of course depends on the hands not the hone.... I actually did the exact same tests as I always have done when honing the blade last night I did a TNT and when the blade was grippy (like a 1k) I lightened the slurry then I got to a point that the entire razor was popping arm hair (like a 4k) I rinsed and went to the bare stone... nothing changed other than I had to do more work with the slurry....

I hope that clarifies it

[Slartibartfast]

Thanks Glen. I was talking to Lee in chat today about what i'm looking for with the different stones in my progression. This right here nails it.

I need to clarify here guys, as I can see a trend...

There is a difference in smoothness not sharpness per se...

I have said this numerous times here

approximate grits to do things on a blade
below 1k = damage repair
1k-3k = bevel set
3k-6k = sharpen
7k-10k = polish
above 10k = finish

All you are doing here is using the slurry to make a combo hone on one stone nothing more nothing less...

If you are talking in engineering terms yes I might get a few microns more out of the edge by using a finisher or pastes but more than that, I am going to get smoothness....
At a 4k level regardless of stone, slurry, or magic dust, you are pretty much at the sharpness level you need to be at, after that you are polishing and smoothing the edge.... This of course depends on the hands not the hone.... I actually did the exact same tests as I always have done when honing the blade last night I did a TNT and when the blade was grippy (like a 1k) I lightened the slurry then I got to a point that the entire razor was popping arm hair (like a 4k) I rinsed and went to the bare stone... nothing changed other than I had to do more work with the slurry....

I hope that clarifies it

[JCitron]

So Glen, according to that table, that would be why many people say you can improve on a coticule edge with an escher or the like?

The coticule can get you to a higher polishing level, but not necessarily into the "finishing" level. Which is also why you can shave off the Norton 8K, it falls into the beginning of that polishing stage.

I have always liked the coti edge, I may need to just suck it up and get a Chinese 12K to have a finisher in my line-up.

Thanks!

[gssixgun]

Yes sir I do believe that you can get better, the C12k if you look at Tim Zowada's website and pics of finishers shows it as pretty darn good...
You always, always, have to put the disclaimer in there with naturals though (these are a natural product and there can be variances between the stones)
You can really do some playing around with the Norton and the Coti and I am sure many others to get a wee bit more out of them using them almost dry too... I would bet that yes you are pushing the limit no matter what tricks you use at the 10k level though...

[Utopian]

Along the same lines as the rest of this thread, I have used a Swaty for the same purpose--from bevel to polish. It was a novel experience, but not one worth repeating.