Thread: Does Anyone have a Devonshire Oil Stone?

Alex

I can imagine that theres probably nothing left to see in Bilston and the poster with the black beauty hone never did post any more info unfortunately

Progress Update 24th August.

I recently emailed a representative for an Antique Tool Interest Group. Although he was unable to provide me with any information on the Devonshire Oilstone or the Moughton Whetstone, his reply included a number of interesting points I thought I'd share.
Firstly, and this seems to be what's causing most of the problems in finding some of these stones, the only UK hones that were available on a commercial level were the Charnwood Stones, some of the Welsh Slates and the various Scots Stones. Other types, were never available on a commercial level, and seem only to have been exploited on an extremely limited local level. As well as the ones I have already discovered I was told about the following types that may also be of interest to us but were never widely available: stones from sites in Derbyshire, Lake District Slates and those quarried from Delabole Quarries in Cornwall.
Secondly, the gentleman in question referred to the Bilston stones as Bilston Bluestone, although he told me he wasn't certain that they had ever been used as anything other than grindstones.
Thirdly, there will be a book on the topic of naturally occurring hones, authored by the same man, published sometime later in this year. In his email to me he mentioned have done comparison studies on the abrasive qualities of various hones as well as having taken microscope photographs of the surfaces of different stones. I don't know if these will be in the book, but I mentioned I was interested in the stones as a straight razor enthusiast, and he said there would be a lot of material that would be of interest to me based on this. He has other commitments at the moment, but will be getting back in touch with me at the start of September, so if there is anything pertinent I'll post more then.

Regards,
Alex

Alex, the forthcoming book is exciting news to me. Reading your latest post got me to thinking that if a person was enthusiastic enough to do it they could put ads in various local newspapers or perhaps Craig's List type sources that they are looking for antique razor hones. No telling what might be found at the local level. Machinist's trade journals in the UK if there are any would be another possibility.

Alex you realy pushing the boat wow. You have done realy great job. Well done. Looking forward to read that book.

The book certainly is good news, I posted a while ago asking if anyone knew of any relevant literature, so a newly published book is something to look forward to. On a local level, I've tried a number of local history groups, but apart from the Tavistock History Society, nothing's been of any help as yet. Some of them even expressly refuse to help with research inquiries

Newspaper ads, and maybe car-boot sales, are probably the only avenue left open to me. I've lost count of the number of individuals and societies I've contacted thus far, some of them have been very helpful ( although I've come across more than enough complete ****'s as well) but there just doesn't seem to be a great deal of archival information or other documentary evidence to draw on in the first place.

One other possibilty, something that's already been touched upon concerning the Moughton Whetstone, is actually going to the sites to try and extact some hones in person. If the stones weren't ever extracted on a commercial level, there's a distinct chance that the mines were never exhausted, so as long as we know where to go, and what we're looking for we could get some quality hones with the added satisfaction of mining the stones in person. So, does anyone know where I can get some dynamite?

Regards,
Alex

As you would be qurying on somebody's property dynamite could be a bit noisy. Can you buy something called Cemavit here in UK? It is powder used mixed with water than poured into cracks jammed and after that it expands and splits the rock. Simmilar to old wooden wedges and water system used in historic times. Otherwise a decent crowbar, club hammer and chisel could do emazingly well. I was thinking to make a small, portable cable saw but have no resources for it here.

Hopefully that book will solve a lot of x hones cases. Looking forward to it, also if some of you guys do mine your own hones maybe you could dig up a fairly large stone to do several of them for the people with really bad had?

Progress is still slow, very slow, however as this thread seems to have developed into a thread about other British Hones and not just the Devonshire Oilstone, I thought I'd post another snippet of information concerning the Moughton Whetstone. This is a quote from "The Face of North-west Yorkshire" and reads as follows: "... a curious concentrically banded (red & green) mudstone... formerly worked for Whetstones for the Sheffiled razor trade."

At least we now know that the stone was exploited on a commercial level, and seeing as it was sold for use with razors it's of obvious interest to us.

Also I have some information for the Yellow Lakes Oilstone. I remember that this stone came up for discussion a couple of times previously, but no-one seemed to know anything about it. There is a Melynllyn Yellow Lake Hone Quarry near Conway in the Snowdonia National Park.

Finally, I have more detailed information concerning some of the sites in Derbyshire. Wheetstones, described as having a, "close, fine and sharp grit," were made at: Alton, Bolsover, Codnor, Heage, Pentrich, Sandy- Brook near Ashbourne, and Woodthorp. There is also a layer in the East Derbyshire/ Nottinghamshire Coalfield known as the "Whetstone Layer."

Regards,
Alex

When you find out what one looks like, get in touch with me. I've got a lot of unknown stones in my collection and could at least get you a decent picture of one.

Progress is now non-existant, I thought I was finally getting somewhere with this stone but alas, leads never panned out and many emails went unanswered.

However, during the course of my investigations I came across some odds and ends of information concerning other types of British Hones and thought I'd share these before finally throwing in the towel.

Number 1: Whittle Hill may not have been the source of the best Charnley Forest Hones after all. There is an article which describes how the hones were processed as a cottage-industry in the area of Cole Orton, and according to those who worked there, Charnwood Hones from a quarry near Thringstone village were superior to all others. However, the material was apparently difficult to extract and consequently this particular stone was never widely appreciated.

Also, I have found reference to an area known as Whittle's Warren that yielded Charnwood hones that were used specifically as razor hones. This area is mentioned in an 1800's work, and thus predates the Whittle Hill Quarry by 37 years, although it is possible that the stone was exploited before the quarry was officially opened and Whittle's Warren and Whittle Hill may be one and the same; although I've never seen another reference to Charnwood Hones being used specifically for razors so it may be something different.

Number 2: Another area producing a Whetstone in the UK is Kilburn. I have seen a reference in a suppler's catalogue naming the Kilburn Whetstone. I don't know if this is Kilburn in London or Kilburn in Yorkshire. If we have member's local to either area they might be able to find out some more for us.

Number 3: Ironstones from Codnor and Woodthorpe in Derbyshire are used as hones. These may be the same Ironstones that were used to smooth out an edge mentioned in earlier works. Apparently these were so hard that only a couple of strokes were used, otherwise an edge became too smooth.

Number 4: Richard Williams & Co's Works at Portmadoc mined slate from the Corris area in Wales which was used to make curved Safety Razor Blade Hones for the UK market as well as Flat Hones for export.

Number 5: I've found hones from Wales, Scotland and England but had never heard of hones coming from Ireland. Well our Gaelic friends need no longer feel left out in the cold as I've found a type of Razor Hone that hails from the Emerald Isle. And I quote, " On the mountains of Mangerton, near the lake called The Devil's Punch Bowl, is a species of Whetstone, the grit of which is as fine as that of many common hones, and being shaped properly and afterwards boiled in oil, it serves the country people for whetting razors." It is described as being a bright Olive Green colour, darkening after being boiled.

Well, that's it for me. It's been fun playing detective, but after months of heartbreak, hard work and ultimately, failure I'm forced to concede and admit that it will take a better man than me to find any, if not all, of these hones.

Regards,
Alex