Thread: Global shi**ing strikes again.

The basic minimum buy in on insurance is $20 US. I recently bought a $15 razor on Ebay. There is not a snowball chance in you know where that anyone in their right mind would spend $20 to insure that. It went UPPS first class, had that option not been available, the only bidder would have passed and the item unsold or relished. How many complete morons are out there that would agree to take the no insurance risk on a tracked package, and then turn around and file a claim. First class tracks right to my P.O. Box so there is no way to lie about it. You can call that little number a declaration number if you want it still tracks it just the same.

Originally Posted by gugi

Or if the 'tracking' number which is really the customs declaration number and not officially recognized as tracking by USPS, doesn't show any activity.

If the buyer is reasonable they recognize that since they benefit from the cheap means the risk is on them when things go bad and they eat the loss. If they buyer is not reasonable they think that the seller should be assuming all risk while they reap the benefits, and so they open ebay/paypal dispute and get their money back, the seller eats the loss. The seller has learned a valuable lesson and in the future runs things the way they have to be run - i.e. higher risk and savings go together to the same party and since ebay doesn't allow the buyer to assume the risk then the seller doesn't offer cheaper and riskier shipping options either.

Any tracking number I have been supplied when the item has been sent USPS 1st Class International has allowed me to follow the package step by step from the sender posting through the US postal system to the border. The time into and out of Canadian customs and step by step to my door.

Fair point about lodging an eBay/PayPal complaint on the seller though. Personally I would be prepared to eat the loss as a buyer if the seller lodges a lost package complain with USPS and hope for the best. Unfortunately there is no way to guarantee that a buyer will do that. That is the heart of the problem, not allowing the buyer to opt for assuming the responsibility if the item is lost in transit. That puts both sellers and buyers at a disadvantage.

When the total costs of GSP can amount to 50% of what an item sold for I am not prepared to pay that on goods. I'll take the cheaper more risky route and assume the risk. That risk has proven to be nonexistent over the years and if I did loose one the savings in not paying the GSP on all the other items more than pays for the loss.

The easiest way for those fortunate enough to live near the border is to have the item shipped to a USPS postal outlet near the border and go and pick it up in person, signing for it at pick up. I have done that a few times too.

Bob

Having been burned once (and only once) when a buyer made a claim of non delivery, I now refuse to ship without an Ebay approved delivery confirmation. If I cant prove it made it to your mailbox, I wont ship. Plain and simple. And THAT can add up to a considerable amount of money depending on where its going. Not all methods of shipping can BE insured, don't forget that. Priority International FLAT RATE being one of them. Which is why I don't normally bother to offer international shipping on razors I don't think will sell for more than 40 bucks Simply not worth it.
I think ALL shipping services have a certain scam factor to them (so do some buyers and sellers!) Like many of you, I simply subtract the shipping from my top bid price, and I expect when I do an auction, others will so likewise.

Originally Posted by Magpie

Having been burned once (and only once) when a buyer made a claim of non delivery, I now refuse to ship without an Ebay approved delivery confirmation. If I cant prove it made it to your mailbox, I wont ship. Plain and simple. And THAT can add up to a considerable amount of money depending on where its going. Not all methods of shipping can BE insured, don't forget that. Priority International FLAT RATE being one of them. Which is why I don't normally bother to offer international shipping on razors I don't think will sell for more than 40 bucks Simply not worth it.
I think ALL shipping services have a certain scam factor to them (so do some buyers and sellers!) Like many of you, I simply subtract the shipping from my top bid price, and I expect when I do an auction, others will so likewise.

Is Priority International Flat Rate approved by eBay for delivery confirmation standards?

Bob

Originally Posted by BobH

Any tracking number I have been supplied when the item has been sent USPS 1st Class International has allowed me to follow the package step by step from the sender posting through the US postal system to the border. The time into and out of Canadian customs and step by step to my door.

We've talked about this before - this is a 'courtesy' tracking and while it may work in many (or for you in almost all) cases it's not guaranteed to work because it's not a tracking number.
Seller protection requires delivery confirmation (with signature over certain amount) and the only way to ensure that with first class mail is by sending it registered at something like $15 extra.

There is actually a way for the buyer to assume all shipping risk and the seller could mail with a cheap service - the buyer sends a 'personal' paypal payment where the buyer has no recourse should something go wrong. I haven't sold many things on ebay and not in a long while but back when I did and international buyers asked me for cheap non-tracked shipping I told them that they would have to forfeit their right to claim if anything goes bad - then nobody wanted that option.

I've assumed the risk and sent things with cheap shipping many (hundreds) times, but that's when (1) I set the price so I can include in it an 'overhead' for the risk I'm taking (2) I know who the buyer is ahead of time and have judged them to be reasonable.

What a ripoff, excessive shipping charges are a huge pet peeve of mine, I have been robbed by UPS with their "brokerage fees" and now I refuse to use their services altogether for sending or receiving anything. I did complain once and they miraculously "waived" the fee...

Another rip off we Canadians have to face at home are those Canada Post outlets that are inside some stores, did you know that they are free to charge whatever they want?

A guy I know mailed a package from the actual post office, a week later he needed to send an identical package and went to a postal outlet in a Shoppers Drugmart, and they wanted to charge him $17 v.s $11 he paid before, this is 55% more...

He wrote to Canada Post and here is their response:

Thank you for your message to Canada Post.
A postal outlet is not a federal government agency and is not owned or managed by Canada Post. For example if the postal outlet is within a grocery store or pharmacy, it would follow the stores working hours; therefore, if the store must be closed, so will the postal outlet inside.

Only Canada Post Depots and Corporate Post Offices are obligated to follow the price of stamps and postal products that are legislated by Canada Post. Any commercial and private establishment may charge extra fees as a convenience to their customers. It is at their discretion to apply additional service fees to products that they sell. We suggest visiting a Corporate Post Office in order to avoid paying additional service charges that corner stores or other establishments may implement on their products.

So now you know, if you need to use these outlets first check the rates online...

[QUOTE=gugi;1344551]We've talked about this before - this is a 'courtesy' tracking and while it may work in many (or for you in almost all) cases it's not guaranteed to work because it's not a tracking number.
Seller protection requires delivery confirmation (with signature over certain amount) and the only way to ensure that with first class mail is by sending it registered at something like $15 extra.

I sent you the link to the USPS site that showed the item delivered, time and and date, tracked every step of the way. When I am sent a tracking number by a seller I would hope it is really a tracking number. I would hope too that would prove the seller did indeed send and it was lost in transit which is no fault of the seller. Insurance I generally could care less about as it can be very difficult to collect it when push comes to shove.

Bob

Originally Posted by Cobre

What a ripoff, excessive shipping charges are a huge pet peeve of mine, I have been robbed by UPS with their "brokerage fees" and now I refuse to use their services altogether for sending or receiving anything. I did complain once and they miraculously "waived" the fee...

Another rip off we Canadians have to face at home are those Canada Post outlets that are inside some stores, did you know that they are free to charge whatever they want?

A guy I know mailed a package from the actual post office, a week later he needed to send an identical package and went to a postal outlet in a Shoppers Drugmart, and they wanted to charge him $17 v.s $11 he paid before, this is 55% more...

He wrote to Canada Post and here is their response:

Thank you for your message to Canada Post.
A postal outlet is not a federal government agency and is not owned or managed by Canada Post. For example if the postal outlet is within a grocery store or pharmacy, it would follow the stores working hours; therefore, if the store must be closed, so will the postal outlet inside.

Only Canada Post Depots and Corporate Post Offices are obligated to follow the price of stamps and postal products that are legislated by Canada Post. Any commercial and private establishment may charge extra fees as a convenience to their customers. It is at their discretion to apply additional service fees to products that they sell. We suggest visiting a Corporate Post Office in order to avoid paying additional service charges that corner stores or other establishments may implement on their products.

So now you know, if you need to use these outlets first check the rates online...

Just goes to show you how much more efficient "privatizing"/"contracting out" can be. More efficient at generating cash flow that is from your pocket to theirs. Ever notice that since this happened the service is no quicker too?


Bob

Originally Posted by BobH

I sent you the link to the USPS site that showed the item delivered, time and and date, tracked every step of the way. When I am sent a tracking number by a seller I would hope it is really a tracking number. I would hope too that would prove the seller did indeed send and it was lost in transit which is no fault of the seller. Insurance I generally could care less about as it can be very difficult to collect it when push comes to shove.

Yes, I know, but those tracking numbers are not guaranteed to work because they are not real tracking numbers, just a courtesy scans of the customs label. So, if the postal service in US or abroad does not scan this label which they aren't required to, the seller has no proof or recourse whatsoever.

That's the difference with real tracking numbers - those are required to be scanned and if the postal services fail to do it they are liable for the package.

It's probably like using a medication off-label - it may work or it may not, but if it doesn't or doesn't work as intended it's all on you.
The only way a seller can be covered for sure (ebay and paypal are clear on this) is if they follow the correct rules and purchase tracking (and/or insurance) which for first class international mail means registering it.

Again I am not saying that the customs label doesn't often provide the same functionality for free, I am saying that it is not guaranteed to do so, and relying on it is taking a risk. I have plenty of customs label numbers which show one or two scans in US, or none at all, and no scans abroad, or one scan on the way but no scan on delivery. That's why I don't treat those as tracking numbers - they simply aren't despite occasionally working as such.

Originally Posted by BobH

Just goes to show you how much more efficient "privatizing"/"contracting out" can be. More efficient at generating cash flow that is from your pocket to theirs. Ever notice that since this happened the service is no quicker too?


Bob

So true, unfortunately.