Thread: question: angle of approach

so, I've been going over my first straight shave from earlier in the day and thinking about the areas that are still pretty stubbly. With blade in hand but not actually putting it on my face again (until tomorrow), I can't figure out how to get ATG for the corners of my mouth (grows kinda south-westish on the left side and straight south on the right side) or the E-W hair growth on my neck on either side of my adam's apple.

Before anyone says to avoid ATG for now I have to say this: I'm obsessive and impatient. As much as I want to tell myself I can avoid it, I'm not fooling anyone, let alone myself. I may not be able to sleep until I feel like I'm making progress.

Any tips?

ps. I'm very visual. If anyone could provide pics I would be in your debt.

first i will say that although lots recommend not doing ATG at first, everyone is different, do what suits you, i did and although it may have slowed my progress learning wise, i don't know how to do it any other way .

that being said, i don't bother trying for an exact ATG on every part of my face anymore as it is simply not necessary, for me. for my neck i go straight down first pass but following the jaw line as i move out, then i do another down but perpendicular to my jaw line, then i go straight up. as long as my razor is sharp and i keep things light pressure wise this does the best job for me so far. going East - West or vice versa is unrealistic to me and not worth the effort. also you really do have to stretch the neck skin to get those hairs standing up, that was a big point for me.

hope this helps.

Near the mouth: I've learned to contort my face so that the blade can "overhang" my mouth without making contact with my lips. This makes positioning easier. I find a simple S-N pass is close enough to being ATG, so try that.

On the neck: I have the same E-W growth problem as you, and I can't say I've fixed it. ATG is pretty much impossible. However, a very sharp blade and good technique gets rid of the stubble, even if you can't do a pure ATG pass. Stretching helps - position the thumb and forefinger of your free hand low on the neck and pull down and outwards. Once you've shaved the lower part of the neck you can then move your stretching hand up a bit. You can then swap to using the middle 3 fingers if you prefer.

You have to turn the blade edge up, thumb on top of the spine and fingers on the bottom. Razor in right hand, toe pointing to your left, use your left hand to stretch your upper left lip to the SW. Then carefully use the toe of the razor to go ATG towards the nose. Reverse for the right side.

WARNING! This is called the coup de buffon, or the Fool's Pass. You can cut a big chunk of your nose off this way.

Normally, you should not use a full hollow ground carbon steel razor to do this. It's much safer to use a 1/4 or 1/2 hollow razor, which is much stiffer and has less tendency to "stall and jump". (A FHG stainless razor is usually stiff enough, also.)

In any case, you should do the coup de maÃtre (the Master's Pass) first WTG and then if possible XTG first, to reduce the length of stubble you have to cut ATG.

Be extremely careful with this! It's probably much better if you simply cannot get an acceptable shave in that area to use a DE for that touch-up, until you have lots more experience.

I think neither of the razors I have right now are amazingly sharp. Gonna get one of those radioshack microscopes tomorrow to check out the edges. Also gonna try using my go-to soap TABAC. I was trying some new soaps today in addition to trying both razors. Cutting down on the variables will help the learning curve I think.

Originally Posted by fritz

WARNING! This is called the coup de buffon, or the Fool's Pass. You can cut a big chunk of your nose off this way.

Normally, you should not use a full hollow ground carbon steel razor to do this. It's much safer to use a 1/4 or 1/2 hollow razor, which is much stiffer and has less tendency to "stall and jump". (A FHG stainless razor is usually stiff enough, also.)

Luckily I have a steady hand, I don't think I'll cut my nose off (famous last words). I have 2 razors, one of them is a Dovo Best, the other is a Vintage Udahl. I have NO idea what the grinds are on them. How do I identify the grind?

totally unrelated, I feel like both of these razors are a little light for me. Are there heavier blades out there? I'm totally uneducated in the matter but something doesn't feel right. like I'm missing some heft.

Originally Posted by Arthur

I think neither of the razors I have right now are amazingly sharp. Gonna get one of those radioshack microscopes tomorrow to check out the edges. Also gonna try using my go-to soap TABAC. I was trying some new soaps today in addition to trying both razors. Cutting down on the variables will help the learning curve I think.

If you didn't buy them as shave-ready honed, then you need to have that done to at least one razor before you continue. If they're just straight from the factory, or well-used, you've got to get one honed to proper sharpness to learn how to shave with one.

Originally Posted by Arthur

Luckily I have a steady hand, I don't think I'll cut my nose off (famous last words). I have 2 razors, one of them is a Dovo Best, the other is a Vintage Udahl. I have NO idea what the grinds are on them. How do I identify the grind?

Steadiness of hand has nothing to do with the danger I described. It's due to the sharpness (or not) of the blade, its flexibility, and the toughness and length of the whiskers.

The Dovo Best is FHG, and comes in 5/8 or 6/8 widths. (You identify the grind by looking at the razor, after some experience; OR, by looking at the manufacturer's description.)

Originally Posted by Arthur

totally unrelated, I feel like both of these razors are a little light for me. Are there heavier blades out there? I'm totally uneducated in the matter but something doesn't feel right. like I'm missing some heft.

In general, 1/2 and 1/4 hollow grinds are heavier, since not as much metal is ground away. The Dovo "Best Quality" is a 1/2 hollow grind in 6/8 width.

What about your stropping techniques? (You do have a strop?) Perhaps you have not read enough in the SRP Wiki; lots of good info there.

Originally Posted by fritz

You have to turn the blade edge up, thumb on top of the spine and fingers on the bottom. Razor in right hand, toe pointing to your left, use your left hand to stretch your upper left lip to the SW. Then carefully use the toe of the razor to go ATG towards the nose. Reverse for the right side.

WARNING! This is called the coup de buffon, or the Fool's Pass. You can cut a big chunk of your nose off this way.

Normally, you should not use a full hollow ground carbon steel razor to do this. It's much safer to use a 1/4 or 1/2 hollow razor, which is much stiffer and has less tendency to "stall and jump". (A FHG stainless razor is usually stiff enough, also.)

In any case, you should do the coup de maÃtre (the Master's Pass) first WTG and then if possible XTG first, to reduce the length of stubble you have to cut ATG.

Be extremely careful with this! It's probably much better if you simply cannot get an acceptable shave in that area to use a DE for that touch-up, until you have lots more experience.

See xman's demonstration here:
http://straightrazorpalace.com/video...technique.html
His 2-handed grip at that area was what scared me most when I first saw it, but it gives a lot of control I found.

If you try the fool's pass you shouldn't be forcing the blade at all. If you get any resistance, if you feel anything less than 100% in control, just stop. You can get great results going sideways without the same risk.

With that disclaimer out of the way...

Originally Posted by Rajagra

See xman's demonstration here:
http://straightrazorpalace.com/video...technique.html
His 2-handed grip at that area was what scared me most when I first saw it, but it gives a lot of control I found.
...

Yes, great videos by a shaver with tons of experience. You will also notice that he switched to a FULL WEDGE for the Fool's Pass. A FHG is just so flexible that even two-handed I suspect you would have a lot of trouble.

I use a Wapi or a DA for that pass, unless I'm already shaving with my Dovo Renaissance, which is FHG, but SS and as stiff as a wedge.