Thread: Is The Sky Falling ?

Originally Posted by pixelfixed

Disagree 100%

So you believe the Medieval Warming Period WAS caused be human activity?

Species come and go. What makes man different is that we are arrogant enough to knowingly hastened our own inevitable extinction. You gotta love when it is turned into a political football because it doesn't matter if you are a capitalist or socialist or whatever when it is your turn to be put into the extinction locker. Believe what you will it makes no difference.

Bob

Save a Seal, eat a Polar Bear !!

Originally Posted by mdwright

I think it's all nonsense. In the 1970's it was about global cooling, now it's about warming. As long as there's a crisis, that's the main thing. Keep funding the "research". What caused the Medieval Warming Period (1100 - 1400 AD), SUVs, carbon emissions? Climate has always changed and we didn't cause it. Regardless of the crisis the solution is always the same, more government regulation, more restrictions, more taxation, less freedom, in other words more socialism.

One of the most often cited arguments of those skeptical of global warming is that the Medieval Warm Period (800-1400 AD) was as warm as or warmer than today. Using this as proof to say that we cannot be causing current warming is a faulty notion based upon rhetoric rather than science. So what are the holes in this line of thinking?

Firstly, evidence suggests that the Medieval Warm Period may have been warmer than today in many parts of the globe such as in the North Atlantic. This warming thereby allowed Vikings to travel further north than had been previously possible because of reductions in sea ice and land ice in the Arctic. However, evidence also suggests that some places were very much cooler than today including the tropical pacific. All in all, when the warm places are averaged out with the cool places, it becomes clear that the overall warmth was likely similar to early to mid 20th century warming.

Since that early century warming, temperatures have risen well-beyond those achieved during the Medieval Warm Period across most of the globe. The National Academy of Sciences Report on Climate Reconstructions in 2006 found it plausible that current temperatures are hotter than during the Medieval Warm Period. Further evidence obtained since 2006 suggests that even in the Northern Hemisphere where the Medieval Warm Period was the most visible, temperatures are now beyond those experienced during Medieval times (Figure 1). This was also confirmed by a major paper from 78 scientists representing 60 scientific institutions around the world in 2013.

Secondly, the Medieval Warm Period has known causes which explain both the scale of the warmth and the pattern. It has now become clear to scientists that the Medieval Warm Period occurred during a time which had higher than average solar radiation and less volcanic activity (both resulting in warming). New evidence is also suggesting that changes in ocean circulation patterns played a very important role in bringing warmer seawater into the North Atlantic. This explains much of the extraordinary warmth in that region. These causes of warming contrast significantly with today's warming, which we know cannot be caused by the same mechanisms.

Overall, our conclusions are:

a) Globally temperatures are warmer than they have been during the last 2,000 years, and

b) the causes of Medieval warming are not the same as those causing late 20th century warming.

Originally Posted by celticcrusader

One of the most often cited arguments of those skeptical of global warming is that the Medieval Warm Period (800-1400 AD) was as warm as or warmer than today. Using this as proof to say that we cannot be causing current warming is a faulty notion based upon rhetoric rather than science. So what are the holes in this line of thinking?

Firstly, evidence suggests that the Medieval Warm Period may have been warmer than today in many parts of the globe such as in the North Atlantic. This warming thereby allowed Vikings to travel further north than had been previously possible because of reductions in sea ice and land ice in the Arctic. However, evidence also suggests that some places were very much cooler than today including the tropical pacific. All in all, when the warm places are averaged out with the cool places, it becomes clear that the overall warmth was likely similar to early to mid 20th century warming.

Since that early century warming, temperatures have risen well-beyond those achieved during the Medieval Warm Period across most of the globe. The National Academy of Sciences Report on Climate Reconstructions in 2006 found it plausible that current temperatures are hotter than during the Medieval Warm Period. Further evidence obtained since 2006 suggests that even in the Northern Hemisphere where the Medieval Warm Period was the most visible, temperatures are now beyond those experienced during Medieval times (Figure 1). This was also confirmed by a major paper from 78 scientists representing 60 scientific institutions around the world in 2013.

Secondly, the Medieval Warm Period has known causes which explain both the scale of the warmth and the pattern. It has now become clear to scientists that the Medieval Warm Period occurred during a time which had higher than average solar radiation and less volcanic activity (both resulting in warming). New evidence is also suggesting that changes in ocean circulation patterns played a very important role in bringing warmer seawater into the North Atlantic. This explains much of the extraordinary warmth in that region. These causes of warming contrast significantly with today's warming, which we know cannot be caused by the same mechanisms.

Overall, our conclusions are:

a) Globally temperatures are warmer than they have been during the last 2,000 years, and

b) the causes of Medieval warming are not the same as those causing late 20th century warming.

Thank you Jamie. Would a large part of the mid 20th century warming not then be attributable to what mankind has been up to?

Bob

Has anyone had the experience of walking through an old growth forest? This is a necessary depressing thread.....too many of the meanest, stupidest and ironically most intelligent (of the kind we recognize) monkeys on the planet....ugh, I need a whiskey.

Originally Posted by mdwright

I think it's all nonsense. In the 1970's it was about global cooling, now it's about warming. As long as there's a crisis, that's the main thing. Keep funding the "research". What caused the Medieval Warming Period (1100 - 1400 AD), SUVs, carbon emissions? Climate has always changed and we didn't cause it. Regardless of the crisis the solution is always the same, more government regulation, more restrictions, more taxation, less freedom, in other words more socialism.

Head over to the library and take out some books about what life was like in the mid to late 1800s in this country. If you don't want taxes or regulations that's what you'll get. I don't think you would want to be living there.

Sure climate changes and there are brief extremes but really it's not so much about accepting the fact that we are creating these changes and believing it or not. You take all the pollutants being produced and ask yourself where are these things going? We know what effect they have in the laboratory. The earth is a closed system and everything just goes into the atmosphere and does what? Logic dictates it has to be having some effect. To deny it is just closing your eyes.

What many people don't know, while they are worrying about greenhouse gasses being produced areas of the world with permafrost have zillions of tons of plant material simply locked away. As the permafrost melts this material will produce huge quantities of methane gas which is far more injurious than Co2. Also as they warm the oceans will release huge amounts of CO2.

I don't pretend to know whether it is a cyclical wave, whether it is going to become worse and worse, largely caused by pollution from industries past and present. Automobiles and what have you. I'm 66 right now, and would be surprised if I make 80. Don't know that I could afford it. So I'll probably not live to see how it plays out. I'm not worried about it because I'm going to be in the New Jerusalem and the climate there will be perfect. YMMV

Originally Posted by mdwright

I think it's all nonsense....Regardless of the crisis the solution is always the same....more socialism.

Hey, I heard Rush Limbaugh say the same thing! Or maybe it was Laura Ingraham. Or was it Ted Cruz.....One of them, anyway.

I feel like the true reality is that we don't "know" anything. The earth is 4 billion years old and everything we as humans have experienced is literally a fraction of a blink of an eye. It is scary because there will be drastic loss of life and extinction of many of the oceans creatures in my lifetime. I sat in on a presentation about using natural plant remedies versus man made chemicals in medicine, and almost all of the prime ingredients come from the rainforest. They are so far destroyed that it is almost sickening to see how much was there to begin with and how little is left now. We are screwed...