Thread: Massacre at Virginia Tech

yeah --- I'm sure that sometimes it's practically an uncontrollable response ---you probably can't do much even if you want to. I've shot plenty of guns and I would hate to be on the receiving end ---- it's a sad thought really --- your genetics and instinct response don't serve you well in such a scenario --- very sad indeed.


Justin

Makes me remember when I did martial arts and I entered my first tournament. Looking at it from the side I thought 'Ok I might have a chance because these guys don't have much technique'.

But when I stood there, I got a sound ass kickin. Things generally look a lot easier when you don't have to worry about getting hurt.
That was my main motivation when the match started btw. to avoid getting hurt.

Originally Posted by jaegerhund

yeah --- I'm sure that sometimes it's practically an uncontrollable response ---you probably can't do much even if you want to. I've shot plenty of guns and I would hate to be on the receiving end ---- it's a sad thought really --- your genetics and instinct response don't serve you well in such a scenario --- very sad indeed.


Justin

It's pretty hard to control basic instincts in situations like that. The perfect example is that shooting victims will often hold up their non-dominant hand directly in front of the gun to stop the bullet, even though they probably know full well that their hand isn't going to to anything to save them.

Originally Posted by Howard Newell

It's pretty hard to control basic instincts in situations like that. The perfect example is that shooting victims will often hold up their non-dominant hand directly in front of the gun to stop the bullet, even though they probably know full well that their hand isn't going to to anything to save them.

They should swing the non dominant hand at the gun as if throwing a left cross
At the same time the dominant hand should be directed at the inside of the gun holders wrist.

One breaks the wrist in the easiest direction to force it to turn and the other imparts inertia on the gun that the compromised wrist cannot counteract.

While you have control of the situation close the range (give them a hug) and start trying to poke their eyes out with you fingers.

Unless its the "Ghetto Thug" with the sideways gun hold and then you just slap the gun down as hard as you can and watch it go flying.
Follow with a kick in the balls while they are looking down to see what the hell happened to their gun.


This stuff is SO basic that it should be taught in school, at least to the teachers.

Very sad stuff. My sister goes to VT as well as works there. She doesn't necessarily like guns but is considering one now. VT apparently prided itself on making sure no student or faculty on campus could legally own a firearm, so for those wondering why the shooting spree wasn't ended by a student or professor returning fire, that's probably the answer. Lot of good the "gun free zone" did for those who didn't make it. They mentioned something on the news that while the school had recognized Cho as a risk to himself and others, nowadays "discipline" is illegal. Apparently the school was not allowed to rid themselves of Mr. Cho unless he had actually committed a crime or been the subject of an "incident".
Seems these days it's becoming the way of things. Sad, no matter where one stands on the debate.
John P.

Originally Posted by Bruno

Teaching and preparing kids to fight is only trying to cure the symptoms IMO.
The real problem is that the USA has a culture of violence where violence is seen as a solution, rather than a problem.

a recent National Geographic documentary showed that Canada and Switzerland have a lot of weapons in circulation as well, yet they lack the problems that plague the US. Weapons aren't the problem, but the fact that people think weapons can solve a fundamental problem is.

Y'know, when people point at the U.S. and say "Culture of Violence" I can't help but experience feelings of amused annoyance (Or annoyed amusement depending on whether I'm on my first or second can of Foster's. ).After all; when it comes to violence the Europeans have we Americans beat handily. Yes, we have the lone, crazed gunman; the mugger in the alley and the street gang but our brand of violence tends to be more disorganized and individualistic. European violence is more... centralized, more organized and institutionalized and so is capable of greater harm to a greater number of people. Witness two world wars,the Holocaust, the Inquisitions, religious strife between Catholics and Protestants, numerous wars of conquest, etc. The Puritans that set up the first successful colonies in North America couldn't escape their violent roots and so America's "Culture of Violence" is, in reality, Europe's as well. And don't even get me started on Africa! The fact is that every culture has a history of violence whether it's against members of their own society or "others".

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

. And don't even get me started on Africa! The fact is that every culture has a history of violence whether it's against members of their own society or "others".

Oh Africa, the problem with American violence is that it doesn't involve hacking villagers to with a death with a machete in some place where everyone is too damn poor to own a camera.

Minimum 100 Africans killed every day for each of the VT victims. I picked that number because it's good and safe, I'm sure there are way morre than 3,000 each day.

We need to fix our priorities. How do you think the rest of the world feels watching news coverage of this crying over spilt blood, in a house that they ducked into while trying to avoid sniper fire.

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

Y'know, when people point at the U.S. and say "Culture of Violence" I can't help but experience feelings of amused annoyance (Or annoyed amusement depending on whether I'm on my first or second can of Foster's. ).After all; when it comes to violence the Europeans have we Americans beat handily. Yes, we have the lone, crazed gunman; the mugger in the alley and the street gang but our brand of violence tends to be more disorganized and individualistic. European violence is more... centralized, more organized and institutionalized and so is capable of greater harm to a greater number of people. Witness two world wars,the Holocaust, the Inquisitions, religious strife between Catholics and Protestants, numerous wars of conquest, etc. The Puritans that set up the first successful colonies in North America couldn't escape their violent roots and so America's "Culture of Violence" is, in reality, Europe's as well. And don't even get me started on Africa! The fact is that every culture has a history of violence whether it's against members of their own society or "others".

One has to acknowledge, though, that most of "civilized" Europe has moved away from violence - more so than USA (if only because USA is a young country, and Europe has had more time to do it).

Moreover, the above argument doesn't explain Canada - which also has European roots.

One way or another, I can only echo what JohnP said: it's a tradegy, no matter where one stands philosophically / practically.

As a father of 2 kids, I can honestly say I prefer to have them fight and take care of themselves rather than wait someone else to do this.

Cheers
Ivo

I don't think it really matters what Americans do right or wrong ---- America is the big kid on the block --- the only superpower (for now) -- and the world has it's eyes trained on every move the U.S. makes ---- every slip up or sway from perfection -- or deviation from the American ideal -- will be noticed or critiqued ---- I don't know if I've read one thread on this forum that critiques any other country than the U.S (maybe I'm wrong) . Does America have a violent culture? It's hard for me to say --I was born in it and know no other well enough to be sure. To group all American's into a culture of violence because of what makes the world news or get's exported through Hollywood films isn't exactly fair. Can Americans make improvements in such things? sure --- But as long as America is a superpower it will never be good enough for most -- if it doesn't do everything but break in half bending over in compliance -- and then it would not exactly be America.

I take America -- the good, the bad and the ugly and will love it --- it's given me everything I have and that's plenty for me.

Justin (paint me red ,white, and blue )

Look what we have done for the rest of the world. Most medicine is developed and manufactured in the US. Advances in Medicine mainly come fromthe US, and while I may not agree with what you say, I VOLENTARELLY, daily for TWENTY years put my life on the line for your RIGHT to say it (cue Dixie Chics).

Phil