Thread: Obamas' Night Out

Originally Posted by Bruno

I don't think most politicians are evil. I think most of them just try to do their job, just like most systems administrators

Oh God help us!

Originally Posted by WireBeard

I am really sick of hearing how the GM workers got screwed...which ones - the fork-lift driver with a High School education who is making $80K a year becasue he is in the Union? Hummer was just sold to the Chinese - that vehicle is the poster child for what is wrong with Detroit. I had a Cadillac as a loaner car once - great engine, but the fit and finish was nothing to rave about - so why the extra $$$?

Also, it should be noted that the President cannot refuse Secret Service protection...if his life is in danger and he refuses to move, the Secret Service will forcibly move him. If Obama had flown to Detroit, very little of the $$$ spent would have gone into the local economy...

And then some. All those americans whining about a massive company going down. Well you know what? That's capitalism and the free market and if you can't deal with it you should move to another country.

Everyone loves the free market untill it screws them over.

As for Obama and security...who cares. There's security with him no matter where he is. Whether in Washington or NY doesn't matter. And yeah flying's expensive. But try driving and bringing the whole motorcade of security and entourage, you think that's cheap?

No matter what a high state official does it's ALWAYS expensive. That's the nature of the job.

Originally Posted by WireBeard

I am really sick of hearing how the GM workers got screwed...which ones - the fork-lift driver with a High School education who is making $80K a year becasue he is in the Union? Hummer was just sold to the Chinese - that vehicle is the poster child for what is wrong with Detroit. I had a Cadillac as a loaner car once - great engine, but the fit and finish was nothing to rave about - so why the extra $$$?

Also, it should be noted that the President cannot refuse Secret Service protection...if his life is in danger and he refuses to move, the Secret Service will forcibly move him. If Obama had flown to Detroit, very little of the $$$ spent would have gone into the local economy...

I marvel at the Conservatives condemning a wealthy man for spending money...why, it smacks of "socialism"!!! Gasp!

When was the last time we elected a "common man" to the White House, someone who was not from the elite?

The only two of any merit I can recall are Lincoln and Truman.

The current crisis is the result of greed - pure and simple - greed on the part of people who couldn't give a rat's a$$ about this country as a nation or its citizens. They wanted to line their pockets and their buddies in DC helped them. How else would someone be rewarded for driving companies into the ground? If any of us "common folk" performed the same way at work, we'd be out on our ears.

These people make me understand the French and their use of the guillotine in the 1790's.

There is no such thing as a fork lift operator that makes 80k a year, trust me I have worked in U.A.W. factories for years. People hear things about union auto workers and think that there all true. The normal U.A.W. worker on the line makes no more than $24 an hour, and mind you that is an amount that is negotiated with the auto companies. Trust me if you had to sit in one place doing the same thing for 8 hours a day you would expect equal compensation, that job is awful. These people often work overtime to cover shifts for other employees or to get specific jobs done the reason for overtime pay is not as a benefit the employees it is rather a penalty to the employer.

The Union members that you hear bout making 80k a year are skilled tradesmen. These guys have more than a highschool education they are trained in their specific fields and licensed. It is true that they normally are not busy when the factory is working as intended but they have to be on call in case the line shuts down. When the line shuts down at a plant it costs the auto companies approximately 6 million dollars a minute at peak operating time in lost productivity. When the line does shut down due to failure or if its sceduled the workers have to work the hours necessary to bring it back up.

So if you were in charge of a factory do the simple math and see what you are willing to pay. 6 million dollars a minute for 30 minutes while an outsourced electrician drives to the plant and the time it takes to repair the fault or 80k for the year for a guy who knows your factory inside and out and it there ready to work? It seem obvious to me.

I am a Union electrician in Detroit I do not work for the auto companies. I will admit that I do make pretty good money for what I do, I was also in school for 5 years to learn my trade I have also spent uncountable hours in training to keep my skills and knowledge current. I have taken hours of classes to learn the proper methods to make high voltage splices and for the installation and use of fire alarm systems. So yes when I go to work every day and work my butt off both physically and mentally and apply all the skills that I have acquired through years of training I feel that I earn my living even though I don't have a college education.

Sorry for the rant.

As far as Obama having an expensive night out.

Im okay with that after all he is the main decision maker for all of the country. And im sure he has the money to do it.

Think about this: how many weddings have you been to that cost over 30k.
My that makes for an expensive evening and i bet the bride and groom werent even the president and first lady.

Thank you, Detroyt. Not enough "thanks" buttons for that one. I am also sick of hearing about the mythical $80,000/year forklift driver.

BTW. If it werent for the unions there would be no middle class. Pretty soon the only middle class will be lower level government bureaucrats.

Originally Posted by LX_Emergency

And then some. All those americans whining about a massive company going down. Well you know what? That's capitalism and the free market and if you can't deal with it you should move to another country.

Everyone loves the free market untill it screws them over.

.

Capitalism???
Is that what all this (spread the wealth) talk is?
Or is it the goverment driving us deeper in debt than this country has ever been with bail out money to companies that go belly up?
Or is capitalism where the goverment takes over the banks and auto industry?
And what about that cap on what some people can make?
Before long if things work out for him every working American will be getting a pay check issued by the goverment.
We all will work for the "state".
And the goverment will take care of all are needs.As they see fit!!
No that's not capitalism.
That is OBAMINATION!= SOCIALISM !!

Originally Posted by willy

That is OBAMINATION!= SOCIALISM !!

Pfft. I wish he were a socialist - then we'd see things like provisions for preserving jobs in bail out conditions, and an actual honoring of the workers' contracts, rather than just the Wall Street CEOs' contracts being treated as "sacred". We'd also see more funding for schools, and a health care plan that took health care more into account than the profit margins of the health care industry. VA benefits would also be a lot better taken care of. Among other things.

As a socialist, I resent the gross mis-use of the word.

He'd also be paid a lot less for the job, and be held to account for the use of public funds for such things as the "night out". Were he to pick up the tab for what that foray cost, rather than we tax payers, I might not be so peeved. Though I would still think it very showy and unseemly given the current economic climate.

Another hate filled remark and I will shut this thread down!

Originally Posted by joesixpack

If you're worried about the lack of fiscal discipline of this government, you should take a look at the last administration. I worry about the fiscal discipline of every administration, and quite frankly, our departing administration left quite an ugly hole in our national cookie jar, so I wouldn't be so quick to blame Obama for the financial state of affairs. It took a lot of doing for both parties to get us here, and there's plenty of blame to go around.
.

If you think the last administration left a ugly hole in the cookie jar then you have to admit that Obama kicked the bottom out of said cookie jar!
In his first 100 days Obama has spent more than all past administrations COMBINED!!!
When you can't defend Obama with facts then it's either cry racism, or blame Bush

Willy, I think you should read the guidlines for this forum again. This is not the sort of place where people flame one another for differing points of view. You're much more likely to win people over to your argument if you post in a polite and respectful manner. And much less likely to get threads locked down, or get yourself banned.

Seriously