Thread: Who do you "pray" to?

In trying to keep civil, I've been reading all of the posts and I'm very impressed.

I intend to stay that way, so don't read my posts as being aggressive or disrespectful -- I am speaking from the perspective of someone who does not find much stock in

I appreciate ENUF providing links to "evidence" that the "young earth" theory is true, however, it smells of one-sidedness and half of the articles use Bible references to substantiate their claims. Even ENUF and GG's most recent posts are verse-laden.

There is no proof that any occurrence explained in the Bible ever occurred, and even the videos posted by ENUF earlier rely only upon eyewitnesses, only because, and I quote (more like paraphrase), "a lot of people knew Jesus and wouldn't stand for falsehoods being written down and passed to future generations." Is this really what the argument is being based upon? What am I missing?

A word of advice: if you are trying to convince "non-believers" of certain "Christian truths", you would be much better off referencing sources that are not religious texts as they carry no weight outside of the religions themselves. And this is coming from someone who studied the Bible inside and out for over 10 years.

Here's an old post from a few months ago: http://straightrazorpalace.com/conve...tml#post383038

Again, this is purely my point of view.. and I'm not meaning to be offensive. I'm just looking for an argument that holds water.

Thanks,

G

OK, here's an argument I feel holds water, even for those who worship science --especially for those who worship science. The primary basis for scientific study is the uncontested observation that there is order in the universe. Without it, the scientific study would be pointless. As science seeks to explain, it must acknowlege that there is a reason for this order. Now, applying the scientific principle of Ochum's Razor, which states that the simplest explanation for a given phenomenon is the most likely, it would seem to follow that the the simplest explanation is that an intelligent force designed it that way. For those who reject this notion, what explanation is left? Coincidence? Just cuz? And for those who naively believe that science is objective, it is not an uncommon occurence that a scientist who makes a discovery that contradicts the accepted theory is basically blackballed and drummed out of the corp. Oh yeah, the survey! (Remember the survey?) I pray to Jesus. But you probably guessed that by now.

Oglethorpe, yes it had occurred to me about using scripture. If someone doesn't believe then your right, using scripture isn't going to mean anything. Jesus wishes all to repent and come to him, but he knows that most wont. Therefore I'm not out to "convince" the world but put it out there and let whoever takes to it, do so.
As I said, many profess to be something or another (christians or whatever) but in reality are not. They put on a form of godliness but actually deny the teachings through deed or some underlying unbelief. I personally know of people, actually a guy at work comes to mind, he claims he's read the bible at least 5 times. I'm not sure how long he's studied for but maybe longer than me. He is still having a lot of problems and it's clear as day his studies are in vein. He doesn't mix his studying with faith and he is not learning a thing. With the couple of years I've been learning, I'm showing him things that he never saw or understood. I only know in part and I haven't read through the whole thing yet, but I'm getting strong meat and not just milk (apparently). I say this as an example of so many people out there that go to church but gain nothing from it and preachers that really aren't called to preach. It took me a while to get my head around that but after a month or 2 into my studies, it came clear to me how and why. I'm not sure if I should get into all that right now as it would involve a lot of typing (and space) and as I'm typing I'm realizing I probably shouldn't go too far in a public forum but rather to those that would be interested.
I hope I'm coming across in the right way as it is late and I usually don't post too much when it's late and I'm getting tired because it's hard to tell if I'm coming across the right way.

Hi,

Interesting thread and interesting poll results. I too was not expecting such a diverse result.

There is one poll choice missing: Jedi Faith. While I'm not a Star Wars fan, I noticed lately that there has been some people stating that they follow this "religion" - article. I wonder what they pray to... The Force? Maybe.

Originally Posted by ENUF2

Here is some evidence you may want to look at...
Again don't take my word for it look for yourself and see if anything makes sense.

The Age of the Earth: Evidence for a Young Earth, Young Earth Evidences.

Proof evolution is WRONG

Missing Universe Museum home page

Biological Evidence for Intelligent Design

Creation Evidence Museum Online - General Information

Creation Studies Institute | Creation Science and Origins

DARWIN WAS WRONG

Just in case your interested here is a little something different on the resurection of Jesus.

The Resurrection of Jesus Christ, Fact or Fiction?

The content of those sites range from common misunderstandings to gross ignorance and incompetence and then some pure fabrications for good measure.

It is amazing how nonsense like "the Earth's magnetic field is decaying proves a young Earth", and "there are no transitional fossils", and "carbon dating doesn't work", and "DNA proves we were descended from a single female (Eve)" gets recycled through creationist websites (Christian and Muslim, isn't it cute when the two unite?), as if these claims hadn't been refuted 100 times already.

Don't get me wrong, if people want to believe something and claim it as faith, I have no problem. But the above links claim the faith is supported by science. This is a problem, because the claim isn't true. (Truth is important right?)

Anyway, enough ranting. Anyone interested in answers to creationist claims about evolution and related topics should check out the Talk Origins Archive, or specifically An Index to Creationist Claims.

Anyone who wants to see creationist claims debunked, and more importantly, be highly amused at the same time, needs to see all the videos on Potholer54debunks's channel on YouTube (highly recommended!). His sister channel has good educational videos: potholer54.

Heres a taster, Carbon Dating:

YouTube - Carbon dating doesn't work -- debunked