Thread: Thoughts on the Ft. Hood Massacre

There seems to be two divergent schools of thought regarding how to interpret the Ft. Hood massacre. Not too surprisingly, it breaks down along ideological lines.

Some folks contend the perpetrator, Hasan, committed an isolated act of murder, probably due to having essentially "snapped", psychologically-speaking.

Other folks see the incident as emblematic of political correctness-that Hasan's known past behaviors should have raised red flags concerning his alleged Islamist-terrorist leanings, and but-for concerns over being politically incorrect, this guy would otherwise have been weeded out long ago. Also, the folks in this camp seem to subscribe to the idea that Hasan's actions justify scrutinizing the entire concept of Muslims serving in the US military, since they may have allegiances to certain religious/geo-political doctrines that are at odds with the military oath they take.

My take on things: while it may be natural to want to draw certain conclusions based upon preliminary facts, at this point in time we do not have enough facts to warrant coming to any firm conclusions. A rush to judgment without a full set of facts benefits no one.

That being said, if it ultimately turns out this guy experienced a full mental breakdown, and acted solely in that context, then we have nothing more than another very sad and unfortunate example of a mentally deranged individual committing a very heinous act--multiple murders, albeit on a military base rather than, say, inside a school or from atop a bell tower.

Conversely, if the facts show he did what he did because of his allegiances to certain terrorists organizations, then the fact he was allowed to remain in the military, if this was known to the military, is quite troubling.

However, regardless of which version turns out to be correct, I do not think either justifies the targeting of Muslims, or any particular group, in general. If anyone in the military is known to harbor views that make his or her service incompatible with their service, they should be separated from the service. Plain and simple. But one person's acts should not justify a wholesale reevaluation of an entire group of US citizens who happen to be in the military, any more than a criminal act committed in a civilian setting would justify the wholesale "round up" of those who happen to be of the same ethnicity, religion, etc. of the perpetrator.

Just my 2 cents...

Originally Posted by billyjeff2

regardless of which version turns out to be correct, I do not think either justifies the targeting of Muslims, or any particular group, in general.

I agree

Originally Posted by billyjeff2

I do not think

it happens to the best of us

There's two ways to go here

a. Muslim religiosity is much like evangelical religiosity except with a penchance for violence as opposed to bizarre public acts like "speaking in tongues," but both maintain that "nut-ball" factor.

b. This guy was just another bad seed, just so happened he was muslim.

Then there's my opinion.

Sex, sex is key, if more men were getting it regularly, we'd have much less violence period. I think the control of sexuality by religion is the biggest source of all violence.

Think about it, if this guy had some hot piece of ass waiting at home for him, this would never have happened.

cheers
D

Thoughtful responses are always appreciated....

What I don't understand is that he managed to kill this many people on a military base, why was he still alive after the first shot? Is this an indication of the calibre (pun intended if you like) of US soldiers?

Originally Posted by Hydaral

What I don't understand is that he managed to kill this many people on a military base, why was he still alive after the first shot? Is this an indication of the calibre (pun intended if you like) of US soldiers?

I would doubt it, if you heard shots fired, showed up on the scene to help, seeing your fellow soldier, how would you be expected to know in that instance that it is one of your own men that is the cause and about to turn his weapon on you. I would say it is hardly a judge of anything when you get caught with your pants down.

to respond to the original post, I am of the school of thought that (pardon my language) shit happens. Can't blame an entire group of people cause on person that happened to agree with their views happened to also go crazy.

Originally Posted by billyjeff2

Thoughtful responses are always appreciated....

Damn! That leaves me out.

I'm a little bit of column A, a little bit of column B. I think he was a whacko who snapped. Religious extremism may have been a factor, but to tar all Muslims with the same brush on the basis of this one tragic incident and suggest that they should not be allowed in the military, or to suggest that they all condone and support such actions is just not fair or accurate. Similarly, treating all sufferers of mental illness as though they may at any point become violent and kill everyone around them should not be considered (yet oddly I don't see anyone suggesting that could occur, just the faintly anti-Muslim sentiments in other threads - perhaps a little biased against the Muslims?).

To draw a parallel, the Westboro Baptist Church picket the funerals of soldiers who've died in Iraq or Afghanistan, because they see serving the US as supporting homosexuality through some warped reasoning and a passage from Leviticus (conveniently forgetting the rest of Leviticus, including the parts about wearing clothes made from only one cloth and not touching animals that walk on all fours and have paws - that means stroking a kitteh while wearing your nice poly-cotton slacks and a wool jumper is right out). I find this behaviour repulsive and abhorrent, yet I would never suggest that all Christians support, condone, or agree with this behaviour. Nor would I ever suggest banning all Christians from serving in the military based on the extremist views of one small sub-sect.

What happened was undoubtedly a tragedy. I completely agree with billyjeff about not pointing fingers at all Muslims, and waiting on psych evaluations etc. I especially feel that rather than accusing a quarter of the world's population of all supporting Maj Husan (not Hussain, as people have been casually misspelling it here, presumably in order to subtly compare him to Saddam) and wanting to do the same, we should wait for the police to finish their enquiries and disclose the facts.

My 2c with some facts.

Look at these slides that Hasan put together in 2007 and judge for yourself (make sure you read the last seven slides). He defends a right of Muslims in the US service to rebel when facing deployment to Muslim countries; and he did exactly that in the name of his God in Ft. Hood. Was it really an act of random madness or a cold calculated terrorist act?

http://www.jihadwatch.org/images/MAJ...n%20Slides.pdf

“We love death more then [sic] you love life!”
“Muslim Soldiers should not serve in any capacity that renders them at risk to hurting/killing believers unjustly — will vary!”

Here is a complete article by the Washington Post: washingtonpost.com

It did not take long for a high ranked Imam to praise Hasan's gruesome act and call him a hero. If you say we do not have a problem with Jihadists, you live in a different reality than me. Where are the voices of peaceful Muslims hush-husing their Imam? (I hope you will post some links)

Fort Hood gunman Nidal Hasan 'is a hero': Imam who preached to 9/11 hijackers in Va. praises attack

Originally Posted by sparq

Where are the voices of peaceful Muslims hush-husing their Imam? (I hope you will post some links)

just some quick google results of those condemning the shootings. If I were Muslim, I should not feel obligated to "hush-hush" the nutty Imams just as I feel absolutely no responsibility to hush-hush the Jeremiah Wrights or the Waynesboro Baptist preachers out there just because I am a Christian

Silobreaker: Muslim group condemns Fort Hood shootings

Muslim leader in Lee decries fort shootings | news-press.com | The News-Press

Arab, Muslim groups in Michigan condemn Ft. Hood shooting | freep.com | Detroit Free Press

Here, one more:

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/...cFJZQD9BS9FR80

Imam Johari Abdul-Malik of the Dar al-Hijrah (dahr al-HIDJ'-ruh) Islamic Center in Falls Church also is denouncing statements from a radical American imam living in Yemen who praised Hasan as a hero on his personal Web site Monday.