Thread: Health Care Reform; States suing as unconstitutional

Originally Posted by hardblues

Well, he probably wouldn't be signing any forms for the Para-Medics

Oooohhh no offense to anyone REALLY but

Perhaps off point ChrisL, but you touch on the root of what I suspect is the issue for most people with the whole Bill. It is not that we as a nation do not want some sort of health care reform, but that there are many more factors which have contributed to the current costs of health care than the Bill addresses. A number of which have been brought up in this thread and all factor in a great deal.

Back on topic: the scuttlebutt I hear is that the state lawsuits will be unsuccessful. But since no one I know has a crystal ball, we'll have to wait and see.

Of course there are those who follow closely the past findings of the individual justices of the supreme court. Someone with that kind of insight might be better able to predict the outcome.

Originally Posted by commiecat

What would you do if you got bumped off your bicycle and broke your arms? Then what would you do if somebody saw your accident and called you an ambulance?

Since I could still walk, I would be a ****ed off SOB if you called me an ambulance, have you seen what they charge for a ride in those?

Personally I would pick my self up walk to the doctors office and ask him to set my arms, if he wanted to try and charge me too much, I would walk to a library, open a book, and learn how to set my arms myself.

If I had insurance I probably wouldnt care what the doctor charged, or if you called an ambulance for me, but then who would be the one wanting to keep prices down?
Doctors would love to see the prices go up and who could blame them, their education costs so much they start the private world in debt up to their eyeballs. Insurance companies would love to see prices go sky high, since that gets them more buisiness, its almost extortion.

As long as anyone but the consumer sets prices, prices will continue to sky rocket.

Sorry about the rant , back to the OP, I am confused about the republicans in Washington whining about state rights now. Why dont they stand on the side of states in the marijuana debate? How do they feel about the original usurper of state rights, the us government of the mid 1800's? Either the states have the right to decide for themselves or they dont, from my reading of US history they do/did. I for one think every governmental problem we have in the US today was started during the Lincoln/Johnson administrations(atleast Johnson tried to veto some bills) and have been made decidedly worse each time the government has tried to solve the problems that came to be because of the change that took place in our federal government at that time. Without the income tax that Lincoln started, would the government have the ability to just spend and spend and take and take? Our government up to that time got the their job done without involuntary taxation, and they were also held in check, size wise, until robbery and vindictiveness became american policy, I cant help but think the two are related.

For all those that love this new legislation. I will never pay for forced insurance, if that means I cant hold a job(on the books), oh well, I guess I will get on the governmental roles and all you that think that we live our lives for others can live for me, cause I am sick of living for you, i'm done. Yes this does sound selfish, because it is, I think we make the world better by making ourselves the best we can be, not that we make this world better by forcing others to do things on our behalf, its not charity no matter how you have justified it.

Where is krisbarger and his wondeful sig line quote by Sam Adams? It goes so well with this debate, imo.

Originally Posted by honedright

Of course there are those who follow closely the past findings of the individual justices of the supreme court. Someone with that kind of insight might be better able to predict the outcome.

The supreme court will most likely be different by the time it gets to them. And it's increasingly becoming another venue for measuring political muscle.
From what I understand entitlements like social security have not been deemed non-constitutional in the past and this one doesn't seem qualitatively different to me (privately administered government mandate). But then again the court seems increasingly more willing to rule contrary to its past history.

Just because someone calls an ambulance, doesn't mean you are obliged to get in. In fact paramedics cannot treat without informed consent.

But of course most people with both arms fractured would want to be treated. It's the rare, rugged individual with two freshly broken arms who would forgo a proper bone setting and at least a large shot of good whiskey to ease the pain.

Originally Posted by gugi

The supreme court will most likely be different by the time it gets to them. And it's increasingly becoming another venue for measuring political muscle.
From what I understand entitlements like social security have not been deemed non-constitutional in the past and this one doesn't seem qualitatively different to me (privately administered government mandate). But then again the court seems increasingly more willing to rule contrary to its past history.

OMG Gugi!! We agree! The heavens have opened, the sun is shining! It is a new day!

Yes we can, yes we can, yes we can!

Sorry, got carried away...

Originally Posted by Jasongreat

Since I could still walk, I would be a ****ed off SOB if you called me an ambulance, have you seen what they charge for a ride in those?

I've had two of these rides, I think they were about 1.5-2KUSD each for about 10-15minutes. The first time I wasn't asked, the second time I was, but thought I don't have the capacity to make an evaluation whether it's necessary. The same paramedic also asked me if I want to be put on a stretcher. In retrospect neither of them were medically 'necessary', a $15-20 cab would've done just the same. I found out the cost when I got the bills few weeks later, so if I were to make a decision taking those into account I wasn't given that information.
Anyways, I paid copay on the order of the cab ride and the rest was covered by the insurance company. The doctor who called the first ambulance knew my insurance would cover it, so probably that's why he didn't bother to ask me.

Originally Posted by honedright

Yes we can, yes we can, yes we can!

Sorry, got carried away...

Good thing it's not November right now, eh? May be that's what happened before, people just got carried away...

Originally Posted by gugi

Good thing it's not November right now, eh? May be that's what happened before, people just got carried away...

Maybe.....