Thread: Obama won re election

Originally Posted by thebigspendur

Do you really feel telling a women she doesn't have control over her body is on the same plane as labor rights?

This is a narrow view of exactly what the issue is, and painted so that it goes your way. You don't have agreement from most about what is life and what isn't life. If you ever watch a 10 or 18 week ultrasound and write it off as "no big deal, it's just a woman's right to choose what she does with her body"...perhaps she should've chosen to prevent getting pregnant instead. I personally would not ever make the call in those laws, but explaining it lightly as if it's trivial is farce. I'm not even going to weigh in on the rape issue, because most people don't believe they have the moral authority to make that decision at all, and that would include me. As our president likes to say, the right decision on that issue is above my pay grade.

Originally Posted by Ryan82

It has nothing to do with gullibility. The problem with your argument is that there is never a huge condemnation from the GOP anytime the crazies spout off their nonsense, so rather than distancing themselves from the comments it gives the impression that they either (at best) don't care or (at worst) endorse the views. Sure, there may be a few lone Republican voices saying that they don't agree but it has to come from the top down if they want to be seen as a viable mainstream alternative.

You guys keep bringing this up, as if the same thing doesn't occur on both sides. I didn't follow much about the first case (akin), except with some surprise that he wouldn't drop out. I thought he should have, and I'm sure most people did. But we dismiss it as a loony toon candidate and move on. Similar to damning something with faint praise.

I don't even know who the second incident is, for the same reason. I don't spend most of my time following the loonies and deciding how I should weigh in.

Is this not the same thing?

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2012...o-nazis-video/

It happens all the time, but people generally choose only to follow the side that offends them, and they write off what goes on in their party as no big deal. I personally don't follow any of them, and I don't care who condemns what. It's a worthless enterprise trying to follow the quacks on the fringe edges and gain some sort of ideological leverage if you can wedge the moderates against the loonies. What's your goal doing so, finding a reason to be divisive against the moderate group of folks that might actually work with you?

Originally Posted by DaveW

It's like relating the stuff todd akin says to being what the average republican thinks. It's completely false, but it sounds good if you're gullible and you want it to be true that "republicans generally believe that".

I actually don't believe that's what the average republican thinks. But I could never ever vote for a party that has that sort of people in their ranks. The GOP should get rid of these persons. Period.

Please don't take this the wrong way

It does amaze me that so many of you guys that are not Americans are so involved and concerned with our politics, and our way of life, so much so that you are offering your opinions...

Honestly I couldn't tell most of you who your leaders are, what their stances are, what your Health systems are, or Tax systems are or Welfare systems, and better yet I don't really care, unless I lived there, it really isn't my business...

That kind of logic is something I can't identify with. I rarely vote straight ticket, and if I do it's because I've actually read all of the candidates issues.

It has never crossed my mind when voting for a moderate democrat that I should consider what the leftist fringe thinks. A moderate candidate is not bound by what the fringers do, and you do yourself a disservice as a voter if you make a vote for a candidate by judging them based on what someone else in their party thinks. It's an unwinnable mental war to draw those kinds of conclusions.

I personally love the post office, and I really like the structure of trade unions and how they manage their business and take care of their members, despite the fact that I don't believe the government should just offer the same kind of coverage universally. The trade unions take care of their members in exchange for work and skill, their incentives for members are grounded in the exchange of service/work the members provide. (Why would someone bust their butts like a tradesman if they could get the same benefits without doing it?). I don't need my party to tell me what to think about unions or the post office, nor do I need leftist fringers to tell me how I feel about them either, I can make my own decisions.

When i look at someone like Romney (who has a history of moderate action, despite election positioning), I don't see even a hint of anything that has to do with Todd Akin. Just like I wouldn't look at any local moderate candidate that I like (I live in an area with a lot of moderate democrats) and judge them based on something cynthia mckinney says.

I am playing devil's advocate in some of my posts above, I think it does everyone a disservice when they don't honestly examine the loony toons in both parties, and allow themselves literally to get trolled by pundits only paying attention to the few individuals who can make them angry. It plays right into the types of political ads that we get subjected to - ads that tell us nothing about the candidates, nor anything honest about the opposition candidates, either. And it's not like it's new, but it sure would be nice in the days when we *do* have access to factual information and the ability share it, if we could get past that kind of mentality.

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Please don't take this the wrong way

It does amaze me that so many of you guys that are not Americans are so involved and concerned with our politics, and our way of life, so much so that you are offering your opinions...

Honestly I couldn't tell most of you who your leaders are, what their stances are, what your Health systems are, or Tax systems are or Welfare systems, and better yet I don't really care, unless I lived there, it really isn't my business...

Well, as your president said, the US is the "greatest nation on earth" so no wonder we are a bit curious about it...

One last comment about health care - if you are a payer, or an insured, and you believe that health care is better somewhere else in the world for an individual who *can* pay, or that life expectancy based on health care somewhere else in the world for the paying side of the patients is better, you're completely in the weeds.

It is clearly more expensive here for the paying folks, but it is faster and at least as good as anywhere, and better than almost everywhere. the gray area comes when you can't pay and you haven't yet made your way to medicaid, or you're intentionally uninsured and you moderate your own use of health care because of it.

Originally Posted by Birnando

Well, as your president said, the US is the "greatest nation on earth" so no wonder we are a bit curious about it...

Doesn't every president say that? And every governor? It's the obligatory part of every politician's job, to blow smoke up the voters' butts.

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Please don't take this the wrong way

It does amaze me that so many of you guys that are not Americans are so involved and concerned with our politics, and our way of life, so much so that you are offering your opinions...

Honestly I couldn't tell most of you who your leaders are, what their stances are, what your Health systems are, or Tax systems are or Welfare systems, and better yet I don't really care, unless I lived there, it really isn't my business...

Yes, well... the prime minister of Belgium doesn't really have a big influence on your life.
The president of the US does have a rather big (albeit indirect) influence on mine.

Originally Posted by Birnando

Well, as your president said, the US is the "greatest nation on earth" so no wonder we are a bit curious about it...

Hmmmm according to what I read Norway has either been Number 1 or damn close to it in the list of Best Nations to live for many years