Thread: Coil spring steel crumbling

I know nothing about steel working or any kind of metal working. Seems though if your going to go to all that trouble, maybe you could melt it all down and start fresh ???

Originally Posted by Nightblade

I know nothing about steel working or any kind of metal working. Seems though if your going to go to all that trouble, maybe you could melt it all down and start fresh ???

Highly unpractical, and not worth the bother in terms of cost benefit.
It could be fun to do, but good stock is not that expensive to buy.

I've a bit of smithing experience, and barring working too cold, which in some carbon steels is very near to welding temps. Of bloomery wrot iron, not modern day mild steel. Another reason or too could be it has sulfur cont./inclusions which would tend to make it hot-short. Or if your using coal to fire your forge without "cooking it" and it has a high sulfur content, each time you take a heat to work your piece it just absorbs more and more sulfur from the coal. Thats my too pennies worth. Good luck!

You are right on with what our resident metallurgist said. I'll give the other springs a try (not the helper springs) one of these days and see how they handle forging. First time really working steel, so it was an experience...seems all my experiences take the rough road, but it's a great journey none the less.

shooter74743,

I'm glad you are enjoying forging (which I find the most enjoyable part of blade making) and I understand the allure of using recycled materials for your blades, having done the same myself. However, I feel that it would be unkind to you not to suggest that you purchase some new, known, steel to work with. It's just as much fun to forge, and it is so inexpensive that it's really not worth the time and aggravation to forge mystery steel. (Your spring steel may well be 5160, but who can say for sure unless you have it tested.) With a known steel you can just look up the forging and heat treating temperatures for your steel, and reduce much of the guesswork. (I have a copy of the Heat Treater's Guide, and I can look up the recommended procedures for you for most steels.)

I buy most of my steel from Aldo Bruno, the New Jersey Steel Baron. I have no connection to his business, but he's a great guy and will treat you right. If you take a look at some of his steel prices, you will see what I mean about it being inexpensive (look at W-1 and 1095 if you want really low prices). I get my forging steels from Aldo, but if I am making an O-1 stock removal blade, I usually buy Starrett steel from KBC Tool, as I like to start with a precision ground blank.

Just my two cents, for whatever it's worth...

I will vouch for Aldo as well. I get all my steel there.

Originally Posted by Nightblade

I know nothing about steel working or any kind of metal working. Seems though if your going to go to all that trouble, maybe you could melt it all down and start fresh ???

A old saying when it comes to dealing with molten metals comes to mind: " drop a piece of hot metal and you burn the floor, drop molten metal and it sets everything on fire, and chases you burning everything in its path."

I can't emphise enough the much higher leval of awareness and safety gear you need and steps to take when dealing with molten metals of any kind. Without proper preperation and gear. You run the risk of loosing everything- life, limb, and property, casting metals. It just raises the risk factor by a leval of 10x or 100x. Be very careful. My own accident with molten aluminium was terrible and i only spilled a single. Drop. It burnt through my pants, socks, dripped down my ankle, and bounced over to my other leg and did the same. It was a shock to my doctor when i asked him to remove the trails of aluminium foil from my ankles. And unfourtanly unlike ferrous metals, which for the most part don't sitck to human tissue. Aluminium dose. I still bear the scars today after almost 20years. Instant 3rd degree burns and steam burns. Hell of a way to spend the summer. Words of caution. Take care, happy forging and good luck.

Yes. Molten metal is very, very dangerous. Definitely NOT something to be done on a whim and without experience and thorough preparation. I am planning to do a wootz melt in the future, but it will be a very well prepared effort when I finally get round to it.

Anyway, in this case it wouldn't be a good idea anyway, because atm there is zero information about what is in there, in terms of sulfur, carbon, alloys, etc. If you want to melt something and turn it back into something usable, you have to know what you are starting with or the results could be all over the place.

Bruno- i couldn't agree more..

Stay safe everyone.

I cannot fault anyone saving money by using found metals. The risk is obvious in this piece of coil spring. It's good forging practice and the investment in that material was for that purpose if it does not turn into a blade. Move on to another piece and for special blades, insist on getting what you want and limit your risks.

Over the years blade makers assumed springs were 5160. Unless they were holding the engineering spec sheets for that lot of steel, the companies who manufacture or assemble could have changed the requirements to something that met specification but was not 5160. The smith really has to take an unknown material and make several items expecting to lose them to testing until they are sure how it will perform. Taking one bar of an unknown and hoping it will turn into a useful tool is frequently disappointing. Sadly, some steel companies will ship some thing "close" to what you wanted because it's what they have on the shelf, you're in a hurry, you're a "little guy" who buys steel once every five years or so, many reasons. It's happened even with supposedly known defined steels.

Either way heartbreak is your companion.