Thread: Current opinions on Zulu Grey and Suehiro 20k? Shapton 30k?

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Hmmmm, Natural stones vary ??? Wow what a concept...

We have argued that for years on this forum, or "The wonderful world of finishers, what we all argue about and waste our money on"

The added dimension of using a finisher is the Guy pushing the steel across the stone, so now you just compounded the variables


I would love to test a "Bad Zulu" myself so if anyone stateside has one that they wouldn't mind parting with for a bit would PM me, maybe we could arrange something As I have only tested two and both seemed fine to me, the first one I tested I ran over 100 razors on and the second one I used at a Meet on only a couple...


ps: Full disclosure I did not run out and buy one, I need another finisher about as much as I need the 8 inches of snow that just fell...

Would you seriously want to test a bad one?!
How about a trade? one of the "great ones" for a so so one?
I have a not good opinion of them, and, I'd love to try a good one.

My first Jnat was SLOOOOW and I hated it until recently. Now its one of my favs. So that ties in with everything. More time and experience and try something different with any stone. Dont do the same thing and expect different results. There arent too many bad stones, theyre just misunderstood! LOL.

Originally Posted by RoyalCake

Can I send you the guy pushing the steel across a Zulu?? I'll put myself in the mail...

Come on up !!!!! Dress for snow hehehe

Originally Posted by Vasilis

Would you seriously want to test a bad one?!

Well yes, I have already tested two that worked fine, so yes I would like to test a "Bad" one,,,, just like the PHIG's when I tested those also, even had to go back to that thread and correct it when I figured out how to make those "Bad" ones work ok... Looking at the PHIGS for instance you can find a distinct difference in the grit/slurry and the way it feels as you work the razor, In the end you just had to adjust the honing regime to get a better result... But there were distinct differences in the stones ...


What exactly is wrong with the bad Zulu's ??? Inclusions ???, Toxic layer, ???? hard grit ???
Or is this something that works, but doesn't work to your expectations ????
I read your post but I didn't really see what the "Problem" was


Keep in mind I don't own a Zulu, nor do I have a dog in the fight I am just interested as to why ??? much like I was interested as to why when I read a thread saying the King 1k doesn't set bevels well, when I have never had and issue with one...
But if you are comparing a King 1k to a Chosera 1k, then yep, it doesn't set bevels as well


I can understand if you are saying, "I tried the stone and it didn't work up to my expectations" if that is what it is, then nope I don't want to waste anytime at all testing another Zulu

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Well yes, I have already tested two that worked fine, so yes I would like to test a "Bad" one,,,, just like the PHIG's when I tested those also, even had to go back to that thread and correct it when I figured out how to make those "Bad" ones work ok... Looking at the PHIGS for instance you can find a distinct difference in the grit/slurry and the way it feels as you work the razor, In the end you just had to adjust the honing regime to get a better result... But there were distinct differences in the stones ...


What exactly is wrong with the bad Zulu's ??? Inclusions ???, Toxic layer, ???? hard grit ???
Or is this something that works, but doesn't work to your expectations ????
I read your post but I didn't really see what the "Problem" was


Keep in mind I don't own a Zulu, nor do I have a dog in the fight I am just interested as to why ??? much like I was interested as to why when I read a thread saying the King 1k doesn't set bevels well, when I have never had and issue with one...
But if you are comparing a King 1k to a Chosera 1k, then yep, it doesn't set bevels as well


I can understand if you are saying, "I tried the stone and it didn't work up to my expectations" if that is what it is, then nope I don't want to waste anytime at all testing another Zulu

No, I haven't found any inclusions, in that case, it would be just that one stone. It could be a bad layer, or maybe a couple of bad layers. Hard grit, I'm not sure what that means.
And, no, it's not like comparing a Chocera with a king, unless we are talking about speed, where, yes, I see some similarities.


I'm not a new guy at razors, or honing.
I know what a bevel set means, what not enough strokes means, or a flat stone means, what is defined as slow stone that needs more time in refining an edge, inclusions, and above all, what an enjoyable edge feels like.
I have tried about every stone that was commercially available on the last century. And enjoyed all of them. If not all, a 98% of the finishing grade stones. Yes, not all coticules are good finishers, there are Charnleys with inclusions, Yellow lake stones with sparkly mica like particles that drop their grit although they look fine, other slates that don't have enough cutting power to be considered hones, and a many many other cases were stones that would otherwise be great finishers, are not.
What I don't like on the Zulu stones I tried is, they are not fine enough.
An 8k stone, no matter how you see it, or how many laps you try on them, oil, water, dry, still feel like an 8k stone.
It's not overhoning, underhoning, lack of my experience, or something wrong I did. I also tried edges from other people with the same stone.
My conclusion is, the stone was not fine enough to be considered a finisher, as simple as that.

It wouldn't take much for me to conclude that Zulus perform with the same consistency or lack of consistency as coticules, PHIGs and most other natural stones. I have had 5 coticules, 5 jnats and 2 PHIGs and quite a few single stone purchases. Most were different from any of the others and it seems from the above posts that Zulus are just as prone to inconsistency as any other natural stone.

I just sold mine only Zulu because I have finishers that are much faster than 100-200 laps. Buying a natural stone is like buying a box of chocolates; you never know what you will get.......

From the looks of Utopian he has seen a few finishers and bevel setters come and go in his day...

Originally Posted by Utopian

Finishers and bevel setters...

There's always a better one out there waiting its turn.

Originally Posted by WW243

How about compared with your Jnats?

Faster and at least same kind of edge, may be even smoother

Originally Posted by WW243

From the looks of Utopian he has seen a few finishers and bevel setters come and go in his day...

Come?
Yes!!!

Go?

I want to get a Shapton 30k.