Thread: Norton 4k feels grainier and rougher than Chosera 1k

I just sent my Norton 4k/8k back for a replacement. Talked to both Woodcraft and the Norton customer service engineer about it. When I told the Norton rep that I had lapped more than half the stone thickness away and still the stone felt rougher than my Norton 220 and dulled every razor it touched he told me that the stone was obviously defective and to send it back for a replacement. the new one should be delivered today. I'll report back after I lap it. This time, I won't spend four hours lapping, I just ask for a refund and buy different 4k and 8k stones.

I found the old thread with the photos.

Now, I will reiterate what I wrote there. My two Norton 4k hones were not components of the nearly ubiquitous Norton 4k/8k combination hone. (Why would I buy two half hones glued together when I can buy two whole hones separately?) The older 4k component apparently used to be made in Italy and the newer one is made in Mexico. MY 4k hones were made in the US and Mexico so that is what I am comparing.

I will play junior poser moderator here and ask that any discussion about what you read in that thread be posted here rather than resurrecting a long dead thread and splitting the conversation between that one and this one. If a moderator disagrees, go ahead and strike off this paragraph.

The first stone I got had its 4k side produced in Italy.

Originally Posted by DryFly

The first stone I got had its 4k side produced in Italy.

The second stone also had it's 4k side produced in Italy. Lapped on glass/Norton 220 WD for 1 1/2 hours, still much rougher than Norton 220. Tried setting bevel on practice razor using first a Norton 1k, following Lynn Abrams bevel setting video. Then tried continuation on the new Norton 4k side. Dulled the razor, didn't sharpen at all. Would shave arm hair after the 1k stone, would not after 4k. Stone came from Amazon and I have concluded that they got a bad batch. Returned Norton to Amazon and ordered a set of Naniwa stones from SRD.

Originally Posted by Euclid440

I go from a Chosera 1K to a 4/8K Norton. I have a full Norton, Chosera and Super Stone progressions, but prefer the performance of the Norton 4/8K and the speed of the hones. I pre- finish on a 12k super stone then Naturals or film.

It is grittier, but it’s the performance I prefer of the Norton 4/8K. I never did remove much of my stones when I first lapped them years ago.

The reason you did not have to lap it down much, could it be because your Norton 4k/8k was not made in Mexico?

Also, how is your experience of going from the Chosera 1k to 4k/8k Norton?

Originally Posted by Utopian

But they work just fine.
Buy yourself a Norton 1k and the problem will go away! I assure you the 1k will feel "grainier." The point simply is the different brands of hones feel different. I have an older US made Norton 4k and a newer mexican made 4k and they both work fine. Under the microscope they look different. I did a post about it years ago. Critically though, they work the same.

I think it's pointless to lap away a significant amount of a hone just because you don't like the way it feels. The original purpose of that lapping was to remove occasional aberrant bits of grit that hung up the blade and caused sctatches. You can hear Lynn hitting one on his DVD. The entire hone was not bad but there was a one piece of grit that needed to be lapped away.

If there are tiny air pockets/valleys/dips on the surface of the Norton 4k, wouldn't it cause small chips on the edge of the blade as you are honing it?

No. They are holes, not bumps. Consider them as negative honing spaces.

After sharpening several knives on my Chosera 1k and Norton 4k, I know realize that Norton 4k, despite being grainier in feel, is indeed a higher-grit stone than the Chosera.

Thanks for everyone's input and re-assurance!

Originally Posted by mainaman

You need to lap till you get past the top rough surface, then it will be good to go, may be you need to lap more?

You seem to have got your memory back, Stefan!

Humorously,
Neil

I just came across this thread this morning, and back in early March I had the same problem. My 4k/8k Norton had a rough spot on the 4k side. I lapped that son of a gun 50% of it's thickness and still could not remove the course spot. IT too was made in Mexico. One quick call to Amazon and I had an entire new set at my door just 14hrs later! The new set lapped up nicely after about 1/16th of an inch taken off.