Thread: Good Question

Originally Posted by gssixgun

now toss in the unknowns of Mother Nature and the variables multiply exponentially..

Too late. The King stone co. does that already with their 8k, ie add natural particles to the stone. Now my head's spinning.

Originally Posted by mrsell63

Mea Culpa dudes,
Here we go again!!!

Are they a finisher ??? as in, do they improve the edge and give a more comfortable shave over the 8k level of Synthetics that most of us use for our SR's

Yes given the right conditions IME with 4 different ones I like the stone and it gives a close comfortable shave... To me nothing else really matters but thanks for asking


As you can see Jerry myself I have a slight issue when people start adding numbers, I have seen the 12k Chinese rated to 20k now and the same with the Welsh Slates.. We have Coticule fans claiming stupid high numbers on their "Special" vein Coti's and same with the Thuringens..

So basically once somebody tags a number on any stone the new E-bay rule is add 5k and sell it for more I think that hurts our hobby

Originally Posted by mrsell63

Allow me at this time to pose my question in a more accurate fashion. The question is: Has anyone who owns a Zulu Grey finish stone found any other stone, synthetic or natural, that compares to the performance of your Zulu? Simple as that.....

Here we go again!!!

Right, I'll give my icomparison of the two I have been using for a bit.

They were a bit different between them, one being more scratchy, like it was a bit harder.

Compared to some synths I have, I'd say they came in a bit under my Ss12, Sigma 13K, Shapton Pro 15k and bout level for my Chosera 10K. Although substantially slower.
The 10K Chosera, while one of my favorite stones, is imo not a true finisher but rather a damn fine second to last stone.
As to the Suehiro Gokumyo's
I'd rate both the 15 and 20k as far superior to the fineness of the Zulu's I've tested.
Heck, I'd take the 10K even if I had to choose!

As far as naturals go, I'd take my JNats, British finishers, at least one of my Coticules and my Y/G Escher over the Zulu.
No comparison really.

All that said, A Zulu is not half bad ime.
I'd say there is good chances of improving on a N8k.

To me that is

I get a pretty good shaving edge off a persimmon if I follow it up with a bright orange.
I use the Mobius stroke exclusively.

Originally Posted by mrsell63

The question is: Has anyone who owns a Zulu Grey finish stone found any other stone, synthetic or natural, that compares to the performance of your Zulu? Simple as that.....

owyhee jasper slabs. Some japanese finishers.

A while back I posed a similar question to Michael Cramer (owner of Zulu Grey stones). His response (edited and reposted below) was, I thought, right on point, insightful and informative:

".....Guys use it coming off of everything from a Norton 8k, to a naniwa 12k to a shapton glass 16k and I personally do use mine to ‘refresh’ an edge much like a barbers hone.. (I even hone (super lightly, on a very polished dry ZG just prior to stropping and this works for me).

The thing is with naturals, they just aren’t these cold, precise tools of sharpening – like synthetics are really… they’re far more ‘organic’ in how they work and it’s very much a matter of ‘you get out of it what you put into it’. If you take the time to learn it’s distinct characteristics and explore which types of steel work best with the stone, well then you’ve made a good investment in a true honing stone. And, you’re likely far more interested in the art of honing than in the mundane practicality of making a blade ‘sharp’ which any synthetic can do – and do well...

There is also the undeniable aspect of romanticism when it comes to natural hones, including the Zulu Grey. It’s really just an ancient block of stone from the African ground, and to many – myself included – that holds a certain allure.. The idea that you can hone your razor to a comfortable shaving edge using just slab of stone from the earth that formed millions of years ago – I mean, that’s worth the price of admission right there."

This to me made complete sense in kind of a Zen fashion...yes I bought one. Looking forward to trying it out.....

Originally Posted by gssixgun

And after all that add in what Dave I think was eluding to also, what about after the grit starts to break down, if it breaks down, does it hinder or help..

Yeah, it's what the stone does when it's not cutting with freshly exposed grit that counts. Can you clog the surface of it with loose grit, can it be used until the grit on the surface has dulled or been smashed into the matrix? The entire point with natural stone finishing is to get small grooves with bigger particles.

The first time I talked to a japanese stone seller (a long time ago now) about using a natural stone, he said "you need to develop a relationship with the stone and then you'll like each other".

At the time I was a synthetic stone user. I tried to use the stone like you'd use a synthetic stone and it was less sharp than my synthetic stones would make, and it didn't cut the steel on a couple of my tools very well. I thought I'd been given a $400 hosing. Of course I eventually learned to use it, and I don't feel like I got hosed now. I do feel like a lot of the natural stone commentary (almost 8 years ago now) was misleading back then, it led people to believe that some of the natural stones out there had tiny tiny particles that would automatically dial up a finish better than a shapton 15k pro.

At least back then, though, only stones that could hold their grit were being sold for a higher price. Now, there are a lot of sellers selling soft stones, which would've been deemed useless, and touting that they are sloppy stones (they don't use the word sloppy, of course). One of those sloppy stones with loose 3-5 micron particles has predictable results, and I, at least, wonder why people would pay $300-$500 for such a stone.

I think I've got it now.........



May da "Grit" be wit choo...........

Originally Posted by Phoenix51

A while back I posed a similar question to Michael Cramer (owner of Zulu Grey stones). His response (edited and reposted below) was, I thought, right on point, insightful and informative:

"

There is also the undeniable aspect of romanticism when it comes to natural hones, including the Zulu Grey. It’s really just an ancient block of stone from the African ground, and to many – myself included – that holds a certain allure.. The idea that you can hone your razor to a comfortable shaving edge using just slab of stone from the earth that formed millions of years ago – I mean, that’s worth the price of admission right there."

This to me made complete sense in kind of a Zen fashion...yes I bought one. Looking forward to trying it out.....

This quote says it all for me!

I'm in the game to shave in a traditional manner with traditional tools and equipment. Perhaps modern synthetic tools could up my game by a very slight margin, but it would be at the expense of my ideals, whether right or wrong, and very possibly a smooth and comfortable shave.

Naturals for me!

Addendum ... and perhaps a bit of a disclaimer ..

I've been through a LOT of natural stones to find the one's that suit my criteria. Two coticules, out of a whole bunch .. Despite what I had read that all coticules get one to the same end . The Eschers are all quite similar, but I do have one that outshines the others. The JNats are quite the same, but again, there is one that outperforms the others .. but, now we're really splitting hairs.

Originally Posted by Hirlau

They are as follows:
Wal-Mart
Location: Flamingo Road & Griffin
Rifles & Shotguns Only
Shotguns: 12, 20 & 410 gauge
Rifles: 30-06, 22, 556 & 223, 243 Win., 410 /45 combo (yes, it's a rifle), 30-30 lever action(only 1 at the moment)

****Note*****
Nothing else at the moment, but the truck is due in at 4:30am

Well. .410 is not a gauge as shotguns go.is actually a Caliber