Thread: La Roccia natural 12K-15K

Originally Posted by Euclid440

Learn to hone on synthetic stones, once you have mastered honing, then experiment with Natural finish stones.
Adding a Natural stone, especially a slurring slate, is adding way too many variables to learning to hone.

Add to that an unreliable and completely unquantifiable “Test” and you are really extending your learning curve.
Minimize you variables and use proven, consistent and repeatable methods or you will be chasing your tail.

Learn to set a bevel and perfect a fool proof, 100 percent reliable test of when a bevel is set, like a visual test, by looking straight down on the bevel with magnification, looking for when the bevels are not meeting, then simply remove the previous stria with each progression, without damaging the edge.

You don’t even know what the grit of this stone is and if it is capable of improving the edge.

8K is all you need, once you have mastered that then look for something higher, most probably your Natural is not even 8K.

I have been honing for over 40 years and I could not tell the difference in the sound of an 8 or 12K edge cutting a hair. I defy anyone to, in a blind test… more importantly… it does not matter.

It means nothing, even if you could.

I honestly appreciate the advice and see the value in it. I'm probably taking myself a lot less seriously than you may be. I will stand by the observation that I noticed differences in cutting through single hairs with one razor pre La Roccia hone and post La Roccia hone. It's that so unimaginable. In the shadow of 40 years of experience I would probably be as unimpressed as you. But in the infancy of a whopping two months honing experience, what may be superseded by years of accumulated knowledge to you, still is valuable to me, as well as others more senior than myself. Like I said earlier, let's have this conversation again in a year and I may totally agree with you. But today you are talking to a noob who will likely believe what he believes until he has seen the proof or dis-proof himself. If the HHT is worthless, I'll figure it out with a little help from my friends. ...and thanks for the help.

So this evening the plan is to take the remaining two razors I use regularly, and put them on this hone as well. They both shave well now, but would like to see how they perform after using this hone. Is there anything I should do to prep this razor like going back to the 8K before I start on the La Roccia. With the insight I've picked up here, I hope to improve on the results I obtained the first go around. Since I've lapped this with 320 grit W/D I'm assuming that it will work more slowly than if I had used 600, as suggested above. Would 100 passes be good, starting with a light slurry, and water after every 10 passes?

It is certainly possible to hear the difference in HHT between edges when testing full hollow ground razors. It is the razor that makes the sound, not the hair. A razor that makes a little ping or ting when cutting through is not as keen as one that silently cuts through in most cases. Not the case every time, but in most cases. As noted earlier by Vic, a razor that passes HHT with flying colors may or may not shave well, but one that fails HHT almost always does not.

Here are my thoughts on these stones. I have both and for the sake of differentiation Ill refer to them as the seller does, the 10-12k and the 12-15k. The seller is off in his grit estimation at least when it comes to my stones. Neither are as fine as claimed. That being said my 12-15k definitely improves upon an 8k edge.
For me the stones re quite fun and a pleasure to hone with. I love the feel and feedback. The fact that the grit ratings are overestimated is somewhat disappointing but it far from renders the stones useless. In fact for me they fit very well in an all natural progression their role is just not what one might initially think it would be given the sellers estimations of grit. The 12-15k could definitely be used just fine as your finisher. That being said the roles they play when I use them are taking the blade post bevel set to my finisher (a guangxi). The speed with which these stones cut compared to say a guangxi or a dragons tongue or welsh purple slate makes them different from these other slates.
You can eaasily set your bevel on the stone you choose for that task, use the ILR 10-12 followed by the ILR 12-15 which could function as your finisher or as it does in my case your final pre finisher followed up by my finisher which is my Guangxi.
If I was looking for an inexpensive natural pure finisher I would choose the Guangxi over this stone.
If I wanted a versatile stone with some decent speed and that could cover a broad range efficiently taking me from bevel set and serve as my finisher as well I would choose the ILR.
If I wanted and natural to fit in my progression that would take me from bevel set to my finisher and do so efficiently I would also consider this stone.
All in all these are fun stones, that are great for the price, that can function as your finisher if need be. The feel and feedback on these stone makes them different from other slates I have used and I like them. I am definitely not sorry I got them.
The recent availability in the last few years of these inexpensive slate hones has been great IMO. It has allowed people to switch to naturals at very reasonable prices. Also the edges that can be achieves of off some of these stones is really astounding IMO as well. While the ILR will prob never serve as my finisher as I really love the edges off of my guangxi, it certainly has the ability to do so if need be and is a fun stone I am glad I acquired.

Paper cutting discussion moved here:

http://straightrazorpalace.com/advan...ng-razors.html

Originally Posted by dickerydee

silicon carbide powder works as well if not better than the sand paper.

Would it work better than a dmt 320 plate? I have a hone stone that needs hell of a lapping job due to stone's hardness and the amount of unlevelness.

Originally Posted by ferroburak

Would it work better than a dmt 320 plate? I have a hone stone that needs hell of a lapping job due to stone's hardness and the amount of unlevelness.

In a word, yes. You can buy much coarser grits of SiC than 320.

Originally Posted by onimaru55

In a word, yes. You can buy much coarser grits of SiC than 320.

I have tried a 80 grit fibre disc sand paper with no success. Will keep this in mind.

Originally Posted by ferroburak

I have tried a 80 grit fibre disc sand paper with no success. Will keep this in mind.

I say this without joking, some stones need to start their lapping on the pavement.

Start with 60 grit loose SiC and watch your troubles lap away like waves on a beach, lol.