Thread: Black Ark more beautiful then I thought

Originally Posted by MikeB52

Following this thread has me considering some ark's in the line up.
The Lee Valley offering of the soft ark, for bevel setting, is that not recommended due to it being not a pike ark? Considering an upgrade.
I currently have a king 1k I use for bevel set and am not happy with it's action. Looking for ideas and opinions, not trying to thread jack but you followers on here seem to have an abundance of oilstone experience.
I currently have the above mentioned King 1k, a Norton 4/8k combo, a charnely forest, phig, Zulu, and coti blue/yellow in my rock box. As well as barber hones and the like.
Thanks gents.

Soft arks are OK for bevel setting, I wouldn't buy the dan's soft ark because of the soft arks around, it's not as good as the natural whetstone soft arks (those are also cheap).

With all of the above, the stones have a wide range, which means that you as the user have to figure out how to get the stone to behave in the range you want.

if you have a soft ark and slurry it with a diamond hone, it's a very fast bevel setter if you're willing to use a little pressure. If you don't even abrade the soft arks surface, then it cuts more finely, but it's slow.

If I were to do an all ark progression on a budget ,I'd order the following (and I have no stake in any of these places).
* hard arkanasas or soft arkansas (not black, black trans or trans) from natural whetstone. what NW calls a hard is actually a fairly coarse stone if abraded, it's not a smooth finisher like their more expensive fine stones
* 8x2 dans black or trans

Both of the above arrive flat. I'd slurry one side of the soft ark, and then never slurry the other. I'd do my bevel work on the slurried side of the soft ark, turn it over and remove the scratches from the bevel work on the side that never gets slurried (nor lapped) and then go to the black or trans (that never gets slurried or lapped).

That'll give a finish, once the stones are dialed in, as good as any natural stone, with oil. In my opinion (and it's just my opinion), using water and soap on an arkansas stone does not provide the right feel. I haven't tried smiths or ballistol, my stones are all oiled. I have tried water and dishsoap a couple of times and didn't like it. The finer I want the stones to cut, the lighter the pressure and the heavier the oil. Thinnest I use is WD-40 (of course that's not an oil) and heaviest is light mineral oil. No need for anything heavier than light mineral oil.

Those of you wondering where you get mineral oil, a slightly heavier version of it is available in generic baby lotion. Unscented unless you want to smell like a baby.

Norton's honing oil can also be found at hardware stores, but it's expensive for what it is, and it's just light mineral oil (and a little lighter than baby oil).

Immensely helpful Dave, I do the same from slurried or rough washita, fine never lapped washita, fresh unlapped black and have to wait until I have a broken in other side of the black and life will be good. Not everyone can get one of those. (Washitas) Would I benefit at all from grabbing a hard and going wash to hard to black?

The black I've got now isn't a very fine finisher as it's not burnished yet.

I found yesterday that maybe 25 laps on a coticule after going washita to set the bevel and black to refine gave me an acceptable no razor burn shave. Just not as close as I would have liked but no real complaints. If I get too lazy to burnish which isn't likely I could always use it in progression with a finisher after.. That's an option as well. I also didn't spend enough time as I had a dulled razor and needed a shave before dinner. 15 minutes later I had a B grade shave.


As for the oil
I like the baby oil it's a little smelly but it works.

Originally Posted by S0LITARYS0LDIER

Immensely helpful Dave, I do the same from slurried or rough washita, fine never lapped washita, fresh unlapped black and have to wait until I have a broken in other side of the black and life will be good. Not everyone can get one of those. Would I benefit at all from grabbing a hard and going wash to hard to black?

The black I've got now isn't a very fine finisher as it's not burnished yet.

I found yesterday that maybe 25 laps on a coticule gave me an acceptable no razor burn shave. Just not as close as I would have liked but no real complaints.


As for the oil
I like the baby oil it's a little smelly but it works.

I think the various hard (that are not true hards like black, trans, etc), washita and soft stones are all in the same category, so there's no need to have more than one of them. They can all cut a bevel when they're slurried and they can all do pre-finisher work when they're not.

I have a jones for the washita because of what it can do when it's not in a rotation, it has a very wide range, but it's not a razor finisher. that very wide range is something ultra useful for tools, lets you use a single stone for almost all of your work. the cheaper non-washitas aren't capable of the upper end of the range like a washita - if they raise a wire edge fast, they're coarse, and if they can make a satisfactory edge, they're not fast. The washita can be both. But it can fit fine in a razor rotation, too. It takes some method modification to get one to finish a razor, though, and it's not an easy always-works-out kind of thing. Under my roof, it requires a linen and a rough shave or two, and then some discretion to not remove the edge again on the next refresh.

Okay thanks Dave I'll just keep what I've got and work on technique and get to know my stones well

Thanks for the tips. Great help..
Cheers.

Originally Posted by MikeB52

Thanks for the tips. Great help..
Cheers.

So . . . when you ordering yours?

May go into the store tomorrow. Hate that they don't have paypal on their webstore..

Yeah . . . it really is a pain in the tuckus.

They are order only gents none stocked in store at Lee valley

Yes, but they will send to the store for pick up,,