Thread: 12k ?

As for prefinisher, id say that is 8k. IMO a 12k is a finisher. So there is no reason someone NEEDS to go higher than 12k. It will give a keen edge that can shave very well. A lot of us chase the perfect edge or want to find a keener edge than 12k. But when you get to that point the comfort you can find with other stones comes in. Than the chasing starts over.

Just keep in mind that after the 12k the final step is only 2% better in keen. Its comfort levels that start to climb at that point. But the most important stone is the 1k. Naniwa stones for me too up to whatever i choose to take to that last 2%.

Originally Posted by Gasman

As for prefinisher, id say that is 8k. IMO a 12k is a finisher. So there is no reason someone NEEDS to go higher than 12k. It will give a keen edge that can shave very well. A lot of us chase the perfect edge or want to find a keener edge than 12k. But when you get to that point the comfort you can find with other stones comes in. Than the chasing starts over.

Just keep in mind that after the 12k the final step is only 2% better in keen. Its comfort levels that start to climb at that point. But the most important stone is the 1k. Naniwa stones for me too up to whatever i choose to take to that last 2%.

Thanks Jerry
I fully agree that the bevel setting using a !K stone is the most important aspect in properly honing a straight. But would you consider using a Translucent Arkie after 8K or do you think you need to go higher first ?
I am certainly no expert, but I would have thought it would take a lot longer to finish properly !
Or am I thinking this out too much ?

Originally Posted by luckypip

Thanks Jerry
I fully agree that the bevel setting using a !K stone is the most important aspect in properly honing a straight. But would you consider using a Translucent Arkie after 8K or do you think you need to go higher first ?
I am certainly no expert, but I would have thought it would take a lot longer to finish properly !
Or am I thinking this out too much ?

If you get a 12k (which the majority including myself like the Naniwa), by all means use that as your jumping off point to a trans ark if you find the Naniwa a tad harsh as some of us do.

My own usual finished edge begins with a maxed-out Nani 12 edge that I take through a progression on my highly-burnished 8x3 surgical black arkie (or sometimes my smaller Norton trans ark; I don't think there is any substantive difference to the edges they produce), followed usually by maybe 15-30 CrOx strokes on linen and 100 or so on a progression of leathers. In my hands with my technique, that approach gives me laser-sharp, precise but smooth, comfortable edges.

Having said that, I am certain you could get there off an 8k with just a little more work. In fact, I am one of those guys who could shave happily off my Norton 8k, but as Jerry said, some of us can't help "chasing" the perfect, holy grail edge.

Let us know what you end up with. Aaron

Originally Posted by ScoutHikerDad

If you get a 12k (which the majority including myself like the Naniwa), by all means use that as your jumping off point to a trans ark if you find the Naniwa a tad harsh as some of us do.

My own usual finished edge begins with a maxed-out Nani 12 edge that I take through a progression on my highly-burnished 8x3 surgical black arkie (or sometimes my smaller Norton trans ark; I don't think there is any substantive difference to the edges they produce), followed usually by maybe 15-30 CrOx strokes on linen and 100 or so on a progression of leathers. In my hands with my technique, that approach gives me laser-sharp, precise but smooth, comfortable edges.

Aaron

I use the same progression as Aaron, with one exception: I go with only
about 5-6 laps with CrOx spray on hard felt, then linen/leather. I, too,
am pleased with the result.

Either way, the Naniwa 12K is a good place to start the finishing phase.

Good luck!

Right now im playing with Jnats and find going from 8k works just fine. As Aaron said, going from 12k is easier as it gets you there quicker. And when an Arkie is thrown in the mess, id go from 20k. Kidding.

I have noticed that many on this Forum set the bevel and continue up to 12k before their preferred finisher !
What do most use for their 12K stage ? ie Shapton, Naniwa , natural etc

It depends on your pre finisher or finisher. You don’t have to go to such a high grit if your finisher is aggressive enough, but it does not hurt if you have a 12k.

A 12k Naniwia is an aggressive stone with a wide range at a decent price $80-100. Here is an old post showing the range of a 12k, removing a chip and finishing on one stone. (12k Chip Removal/ Bevel Setting).

I typically go to an 8k then a finisher. I like the Naniwia Snow White Junpaku, but any 8k will work, especially if going to a finisher. Only after 8k does an edge get really straight. At 12k a bit straighter, so if you are going to a natural finisher or a 20k you will start with a very straight and keen edge, and all you are looking for is comfort and a bit of additional keenness.

The 12k is a finisher, if it is harsh, try some Chrome Oxide, Cerium or CBN on a pasted cotton or Pellon strop. Or finish your edge on the 12k, then lightly joint (one lite stroke on the corner of the stone) to remove the very edge. Strop on linen, firehose or canvas strop. Reset the edge with 15-20 X laps strop and test shave.

For finishing on a Jnat I start with a 8k edge, for finishing with a Ark I start with a 10 or 12k and sometimes a 20k edge. Arks are slower, Jnat with Diamond slurry can be more aggressive.

That you almost never see a used 12k Naniwia for sale, is a testament of the stone’s performance and favor.

Originally Posted by Euclid440

I have noticed that many on this Forum set the bevel and continue up to 12k before their preferred finisher !
What do most use for their 12K stage ? ie Shapton, Naniwa , natural etc

It depends on your pre finisher or finisher. You don’t have to go to such a high grit if your finisher is aggressive enough, but it does not hurt if you have a 12k.

A 12k Naniwia is an aggressive stone with a wide range at a decent price $80-100. Here is an old post showing the range of a 12k, removing a chip and finishing on one stone. (12k Chip Removal/ Bevel Setting).

I typically go to an 8k then a finisher. I like the Naniwia Snow White Junpaku, but any 8k will work, especially if going to a finisher. Only after 8k does an edge get really straight. At 12k a bit straighter, so if you are going to a natural finisher or a 20k you will start with a very straight and keen edge, and all you are looking for is comfort and a bit of additional keenness.

The 12k is a finisher, if it is harsh, try some Chrome Oxide, Cerium or CBN on a pasted cotton or Pellon strop. Or finish your edge on the 12k, then lightly joint (one lite stroke on the corner of the stone) to remove the very edge. Strop on linen, firehose or canvas strop. Reset the edge with 15-20 X laps strop and test shave.

For finishing on a Jnat I start with a 8k edge, for finishing with a Ark I start with a 10 or 12k and sometimes a 20k edge. Arks are slower, Jnat with Diamond slurry can be more aggressive.

That you almost never see a used 12k Naniwia for sale, is a testament of the stone’s performance and favor.

Many thanks for a very informative answer, I will order 12k Naniwa and give it a good try a d vary the finisher.
I have an Escher, aThuringian, Coty and Charnley Forest.
I don’t know if you have ever used a Charnley, but I find it a really hard smooth finisher !
Thanks again
Phil