Thread: Shapton Ceramic on glass hones

Originally Posted by kaptain_zero

While I am perfectly happy with the results I am getting from my Norton 4k/8k, and blue/yellow coticule with a chrome oxide finish, I am still contemplating ordering a full series of Shaptons based on the various comments I've read.

Shaptons bring order to the madness. The grit size of these manufactured hones is carefully controlled. The binder allows for frequent lapping with a quality diamond lap that is also available from Shapton. I think it's the ultimate honing system, the combination of the ceramic grit and the lapping system should accommodate just about any type of steel, tool etc. made and make it easy to establish a honing system or pattern if you will. Natural stones work well with traditional steels but when facing newer stainless varieties and harder alloys, the traditional stones begin to struggle. The Shapton hones, using modern ultrasharp ceramic grit, can cut pretty much any hardness of steel with the same ease as older, plain vanilla, carbon steel.

Dr. Moss has found this to be pretty much the case and has a set progression when dealing with previously sharpened by himself razors. I'm sure the outside extremes such as wedges vs singing hollow grounds might require some modification of the normal honing pattern, but the actual composition of the steel the blade is made from shouldn't make much of a difference with these modern hones.

Naturally, the proof as always lies in the pudding.... I guess I'll just have to get around to ordering a set for myself to see just what these Shapton stones are capable of....


Regard

Kaptain "Curious George" Zero

Hey Kap, I've been bitten by the Shapton bug myself, although I can't spring for a whole set at once. We'll have to report back our findings here. I'm looking forward to lapping ALL my stones with the diamond on glass plate (I think I'll take a closeup of it which will be my new avatar) and polish my edges with the 16,000.

Chris L

Great discussion here, guys. I'm really looking forward to following your progress.

Ken

I'm still waiting for my new Shapton Diamond on Glass Lapping Plate (DGLP to the woodworker community that uses Shapton products).

An Australian woodworker emailed me this morning and told me coincidentally he's been shaving with straights for 20 years! He knows about the B&B site, but I encouraged him to join here.

Anyway he says he uses an older ceramic stone similar to the Spyderco dry rather than wet. He's going to try the Shapton ceramic on glass dry rather than wet and let me know his thoughts.

My 16000 grit ceramic on glass is "waiting in the wings" for the DGLP to get here so I can lap it properly. I have a bunch of mid grit naturals (Yellow/Blue coticules, Tam and Chinese 12K) but for bevel setting, I'm torn on whether to buy the Shapton ceramic on glass 1000 grit or the 2000 grit..... I haven't decided yet.

Either way, when I get the DGLP for lapping and get a bevel setting grit Shapton stone, I'll most likely be putting my DMT 325 & 1200 grits up for sale on SRP.

Chris L

I dont know if anyone has checked out the side by side comparison of all the popular hones done on B&B http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php?t=29575 but it seems the shapton 16k got the thumbs up over there and that looked like a pretty thorough test.

Fwiw.

I know the thread is about Shaptons glass-backed hones - the equal of the Pro series in function, and cheaper - but there is something I would add about the diamond glass lapping plate.

It's addictive.

Not only does it flatten and clean steel residue from the hones, it works some special magic on an unrelated hone - the Spyderco UF. I've seen the video of the Spyderco rep saying it's a 2000 mesh hone, and I have read that it is the same ceramic mix as the coarser hones, and the etched pattern on the surface determines the grit/mesh equivalent. To tell the truth, I had no luck from the UF at all and wasn't using it until I got the DGLP. Now I have lapped the machining marks from its surface, and I have been trying to fit it into the series of Shaptons I use when progressing through them. I thought it was right, at first, between the 8k and the 15k, and would finish on the 30k. Just lately I have been trying things in a different order, and I'm getting really nice results from using the UF last. I wish I had some way of measuring the grit that would work here, but I don't see how without a scanning electron microscope. If Spyderco use one ceramic mix and mill the surface into the grit they want, then the more I lap the finer stone I have, up to the point at which I come up against the particle size in their mix. As things stand, I would strongly recommend the Shaptons, but if you can afford the DGLP then the Spyderco UF might save you buying the 15k and 30k. For all I know, it might be used on the medium and fine Spydercos to good effect also, but I don't have them and can't justify them with the Shaptons here to use.

Chris

I'm getting a few Shapton GS stones for my AS kitchen knives. I've been in discussions on the KF Kitchen knives forum and I'm pulling the GS stones... I've used the progression from 220 to 2k flatten the bevel on a T. Masamoto blue steel Takobiki. They cut well and stayed reasonably flat durring the 3 hours of grinding

If they stand up to that treatment a straight will take FOREVER to dish one

Just took the plunge yesterday and ordered the 16k - I'm getting an interesting mix happening with my whetstones as time goes by:

2-4k no-name ex-oilstone -> 4k Norton -> 6k (ish) natural Japanese -> 8k Norton -> 8-10K natural Taiwanese -> 10-12k (ish) natural Japanese -> 16k Shapton.

Thank heavens my HAD is only limited to the Asian continent, otherwise I'd have to try to slip the Belgians and Thuringians in there too

James.