Thread: Synthetic Hones Designed For Straight Razors ?

I know very little about metallurgy and I don't know anything about chisels neither American nor Japanese. It seems that the synthetic hones are made primarily with those who sharpen tools as the target market. Anyone know what A2 is comparable to in straight razors ? Blue steel, white steel ? I guess I just wonder how optimal Shaptons, Nortons, Naniwas are for razors. I know they are very good but if they were to design hones targeting straight razors I wonder if the binder/abrasive would be any different ?

The Norton 4/8K would be a 6" x 2" combo.... perfect!

Thanks but the Norton was designed for tools. Hard edges like chisels and plane blades. The question is what would the nature of the synthetic hone be if it had been designed for straight razors ? Not for touching them up like barber hones but for honing them to a shaving edge.

I know that the Nortons, Shaptons etcetera work since I use them but I am just wondering if something engineered for straights would be better.

If I am not mistaken, most vintage coticules are water stones (like the Nortons), about 6” long and were not only used for touch-up, but also for getting a razor back to a shaving edge.
I thought all straights have hard edge… maybe a lot thinner than chisels and plain blades but just as hard.
I believe there is such a wide variety synthetic hones to sharpen all kinds of tools that there has to be one that will do for razors even if it was not meant for such… only difference would be the size, because many will want to hold the hone in there hands… difficult with a Norton.

This has me thinking to hard

Let me see if I have this straight, Your looking for a synthetic stone where the abrasive and binders are geared to the geometry and makeup of the average straight razor?

I may be off here but I would think that the plane blade and a straight razor where after the same level of polish.

I know that white steel and blue steels have a slight difference in feel on some stones. The more additives the steel has, tward the dreaded stainless, more wear resistance and reactive qualities some stones display. Glasing of a King 6k happens FAST when any stainless blade is used on them. But a white or blue steel blade can go hondreds of laps with no glasing. I find that shapton GS stones glase over with different carbon steels rather quickly. Even with straight razors this has been a problem for me at times.

So far the only thing I have found usefull in a synthetic is mostly size vs target item and will it work best with carbon or stainless.

I'm still testing out all these things as well and I guess I always will be, unless I get filthy rich enough to afford all the stones and all the makes of steel

What tools are the higher grit stones marketed towards?

The naniwa stones seem almost too soft for tools.

Am I missing something here? Isn't a barbers hone a synthetic hone specifically designed for razors?

Originally Posted by Chimensch

Am I missing something here? Isn't a barbers hone a synthetic hone specifically designed for razors?

Bingo but used to be not anymore.No one makes Barber hones in current time.May be i will open a new business and start making barber hones for new fragile,lazy Generation.

Originally Posted by Slartibartfast

What tools are the higher grit stones marketed towards?

The naniwa stones seem almost too soft for tools.

I was googling around looking for info on coticules and what have you. I came across this here in google books. On page 168 the author says that because of the hardness of garnets the Belgian stone is on par with the Arkansas except that the rock is of such soft composition that tool edges pressed upon it cut the stone. He goes on to say that Belgian whetstones are suitable only for razor hones.

So I've never sharpened a plane blade or a chisel and I'm assuming that considerably more pressure is used ? If I am correct than these synthetic stones are designed with that in mind. The Escher and the coticule were favored by jewelers and maybe tool and die makers as well as barbers who were sharpening small tools with fine edges. Therefore a stone that had plenty of abrasive but was too soft (like the Belgian Coticule) for heavier cutting tools might be better for razors than what we have.

Originally Posted by Chimensch

Am I missing something here? Isn't a barbers hone a synthetic hone specifically designed for razors?

I was thinking the same thing, but a barbers hone is for finishing only. I'm thinking you would need to design a series of at least 3 hones that can work at bevel setting, refining, and polishing. You couldn't just make 1 universal stone.

In a perfect world, the stones should be formulated to work with a specific hardness, or Rockwell rating. If the razors were rated as well, it would make for the beginning of a good classification system.

Shapton is kind of already doing something similar to this. The glass stones are specifically designed for the A2 steel that is cold hardened to R.63. They have also come out with a Japanese Glass version, which is designed for carbon steel tools. They have the JP 4K and JP 8K, which are gray in color. (I have one of each on order, and I will venture that they will be harder than the regular glass, and feel more like the pros.) The pros have the 220 and 1k which are actually designed for stainless steels and a the 320 and 1,500, which are for carbon steels (its makes a difference).

So Shapton has kind of started to break things down into the ranges of hardness of the tools. Wether or not Norton and the like have actually thought about matching the stones cutting ability to the hardness range of the tools, I don't know. I somehow doubt it. I think those hones were made for a specific application (just like the glass are) and then they sold them to anyone who wanted one. Not everyone in the mass markets are as crazy as us

The general rule is, though: harder steel = softer stone. Softer steel = harder stone.

Jimmy, I'd like to think about this more......It's a tough question