Thread: Shapton GS 16k as a finish

Tonight I touched up my TI SRP LE and finished it on the 16k S GS. After a few laps (5-10) I could feel the difference on the hone and through a loop (30x) I could see a great polish/finish. So off to the strop and shave time.

I know others that swear by these stones and their finish... but I'm aftraid I'm not one of them, very rough shave compared to my coti and oohira stones.

Ether I'm missing something about this stone (S GS 16k) or it just doesn't like me. The last time I used the stone I polished it with the flattened S GS 3k to get all the scratches out from the DMT 325. Ver smooth finish and no light under the straight ruler. So I'm reasonably sure it's not a bad surface, to my knoweledge so far. I know the 30k is extreamly finiky but I haven't heard much about the 16k having this kind of issue.

From those that use the 16k S GS could you tell me how you use the stone to get great finished edges... I fear stone has just about out lived it's usefullness unless I learn a new trick or two in it's use.

I think the 16K, and all Shaptons will give a "rougher" feeling edge that you described because the material that makes the scratches is constant, and the soft binding exposes new abrasive quickly, leaving relatively deeper scratches in the edge.

Other stones such as Norton and Kings, are made with much softer abrasive and binding materials, so the scratches are not as deep. That's what gives you that smoother feeling.

In my experimenting lately, The amount of pressure is a big influence on the results. A little pressure on Shaptons goes a long way because they cut so fast. Other stones are more forgiving, the reasons being the same as listed above.

I REALLY lightened up my stroke on the Shaptons, and have gotten some really good shaves recently, but I go to 30K. There is a major difference in the edge between 16K and 30K IMO. I also noticed that if I really made the effort to stretch the skin, the razor responded much better than if the skin was not as taught. (Got my first BBS this weekend, BTW!)

at first please don't use pressure
second do you have chro2?
if yes then go head after the 16k do 20-30 laps on chro2 you should be ok.
if you don't have chro2 i think CHRISL was selling it very cheap you can contact with him. Gl
hope this helps.

5-10 passes. The practices I employ sometimes would probably make the 5-10 pass veteran honers shriek. Or maybe they'd say my edge wasn't where it needed to be; either way, I've done significantly more passes on my 16k than 5-10. Easily 25 passes and on a few razors, to 100 passes. Wire edge? Nope. Very light pressure? Yes. No pressure? No.

I'd fly in the face of convention and say try more passes, test shave and report back. 25 still harsh? Try 50 and shave. Still harsh? Try 100 passes and shave and let us know. I'll be curious to see if with each set of 25 or 50 you do, if you report back and say "Wow, after 50 passes the shave was twice as harsh and at 100 passes it was 5 times as harsh!!" I'm really curious about that.

Please keep us posted.

Well over a year ago, I recall emailing Dr. Chris Moss about his take on the 16k, a stone, which at the time anyway, he thought very highly of. IIRC he said he thought it would be difficult to impossible using the normal honing technique to "overhone" on the 16k. FWIW.

I do have some chrome ox left and I do most often finish with chrome ox.

Chris L

I trust Hi Bud for knowing what to do, but it sure seems a shame to still need cro after such a fine grit. I know some people always use paste or multiple paste after 30k even; but still the point of it all goes over my head- to smooth the edge- I guess that's what they say.

But why does it need that? I do not believe it is a problem with the stone- the steel maybe, or you just didn't get the touch quite right.

I believe 16k + is what naturals are for. I'm just saying what the heck, try it again- maybe even give the HMS jointing technique a try

After all i do bleive harshness comes from a bur, wire or some such thing- not sharpness.

I've not used the Shapton 16k yet, but I will say that if you're used to a coticule edge, going to something else finer and sharper can be tricky. The coticule edge, IME, allows for your shaving technique and pressure to be quite liberal without any harshness or irritation. With sharper and finer edges, I've found that you need th pay more attention to using less pressure especially, but also watch your angles a bit more too. This isn't to say that you won't like finer edges better once you've adjusted, I'm just saying that the coticule is pretty forgiving, so there may be an adjustment period.

Just throwing that out there based on my limited experience so far. You're problem(s) may be completely unrelated.

I have zero experience (still) with the Shapton 16K, but I think there are several members who hone on the 16k and then fall back to a coticule and/or chrome ox to smooth out the edge a bit. I also think that some have reported the edge directly off the 16k can be a bit harsh for their particular skin type.

Am I wrong?

I woild like to know what's the abrasive material is in those Shaptons (unless it’s a trade secret).

Abrasives such as silicon carbide will make deep scratches in steel, and garnets (I think Al oxide) will make shallow scratches… all other things being equal the edges will make for completely different shaves… that is, for those of us who DO NOT finish with pastes.

Anyone know what’s the main abrasive in the Shaptons?
Maybe this question should be addressed to Jendeindustries.

I've been experimenting with the 16K and also CrO and the half micron diamond spray. I like the GlassStones because they cut fast. However, the 16K hasn't been guaranteed finishing magic for me. Maybe I haven't used enough strokes?

Originally Posted by hi_bud_gl

at first please don't use pressure
second do you have chro2?
if yes then go head after the 16k do 20-30 laps on chro2 you should be ok.
if you don't have chro2 i think CHRISL was selling it very cheap you can contact with him. Gl
hope this helps.

I do have Cro2, plenty of it, I'll work that edge on it tonight and see how it shaves tomorow.

This is kind of an "out loud" responce to my own questions about the hones I have. I have 3 "finishing" hones, and this is me testing them out. I have tested the coti and I'm pretty happy with it. Now I'm working out the bugs to get the S GS 16k to work for me. Next will be the Oohira hone.

If the Cro2 makes this work and I get great shaves off it, than it will not be a lost cause Not what I would want to do every time but the knowelege will be worth it.