Thread: Hone troubles

I have a couple problems with my hones and am in need of some advice.

First one is, I bought a barber hone(velvet edge) off of ebay and it looks like the previous owner used oil. It is my understanding that barber hones can be used with oil, water or lather so its not a huge problem. It is just that I was hoping to use the water or lather options. Is there any way to remove the oil other than lapping for half a day(or more)? I dont really want end up with a 1/4 inch tall hone either.

The other problem is the one that worries me the most. I also bought a Jnat off ebay, about a day before I found out about Old School and 330mate and all the others that would of been a far better place to buy a stone from. It is a pretty green color maybe a little greenish blue but it has a different vein of something(black w/ brownish borders) running about 3/4 of the way down the face. When I first used the Jnat I got all tingly cause it was cutting good and was leaving a mirror finish but then I noticed my bevels were looking funny, the toe end was falling behind the heel end. I took the razor back to the 4k/8k norton to straighten it back up, and tried again but same thing happened. Since the toe was starting on the other side of the vein I am thinking that maybe the material in the vein is harder than the stone and not letting the toe end start to cut(holding it up a bit) until it crosses over. The stone was sloping away from the vein a little, I thought it was just that the previous owner using it to sharpen tools or knives or something, now i'm not so sure. Today I decided to do the unthinkable(sorry OS) and I lapped it, it started just with one of the edges so I could use the side but quickly turned to the face. I figure to hell with the stamps, I wouldn't feel right re-selling it anyway if there is a problem with it, and if not i'll be keeping it anyway since i've got to start catching jimmyhad some how. I did take some pictures though before I erased the stamps. I was wondering if it would be possible to take a small round carbide bit on a dremel and just keep the vein lower than the surface, since it runs perpendicular with the honing motion?
On the other hand it just may be my honing stroke that is causing the problems I am blaming on the vein although I just dont understand how I can create a decent edge on the 4/8k nortons and then mess it up on the Jnat. I am not planning on doing anything to the stone till further down the road, after I get a little more experience under my belt, but I am starting to look for options. Thanks in advance for any and all suggestions.

it is possible that you indeed need to lap the stone. Recently there was a poll about that and almost all posters had lapped their Jnats.
Before lapping, please make sure that you take pics of the stone with the stamps etc.

Jason, Easy Off Fume Free oven cleaner is what Howard from the Perfect Edge recommended in this "How to clean oil from a hone" thread here. He said to get the blue can as the yellow one will 'stink up the house'.

I don't know what to tell you about the J-nat. OS or kevint will probably have some input on that soon enough.

Pics of the stone and the problem would be helpful. I am having problems visualizing what is happening.

BTW, So from Japan-tool says lapping is a good idea when honing razors. I am still learning my view of that but seem to be leaning towards lapping. I just think that lapping by not be enough.

+1 to JimmyHAD

Easy Off will work great for cutting through grease/oil. I have used oil eater, works the same really.

Like the others have said, pictures would make the understanding of the J-nat problem easier to understand and offer help with.

When you said perpendicular to the honing motion, did you mean parallel? Because if it was perpendicular to your honing motion, the edge of your blade would drop down in the crack you make from cutting it out.

Or perhaps you meant perpendicular to the cutting edge while honing?



Pics plz

Thanks for the help so far guys heres some pictures of the stone and vein.

Well I tried to add pictures but couldnt get the attachment option to work, so here is the ebay listing number 260513752102, I think it is the 2nd picture that shows the vein the best and I will try to add the photos to my album if I can. Thanks again.

-jason

Edit: I think I got the pictures figured out. I included pictures of the stamps and am hoping someone might translate them. Thanks.

Originally Posted by OLD_SCHOOL

Depending on the circumstances surrounding the purchase, I.E it was advertised as a "razor" hone, I would have recommend you contact the seller and see if you could return it though your chances would have been slim, but since you have lapped it, it's pretty much too late.

I don't think grinding the inclusion lower than the hone will work, because the edge of the razor might go into the small recess and then hit the other side, thus damaging the edge. Does the inclusion go right through the hone? If not, then you "may" get away with lapping the base and using that. Depending on the thickness of the hone, you "could" even lap one of the sides, however this will bring great risk. Hone sides absorb water like a sponge, OK that's an exaggeration, but they do absorb faster than the surface. If you feel that the hone may already be a write-off, then whatever you choose to do to it in order to extend it's life a little further to make it worth your money, won't really make much difference.

Regular table salt can assist in removing some oil. It worked for me and an Escher, though the Escher was only exposed to a small amount of oil for a day or two.

I cant really tell if it goes all the way through because the bottom still is covered with the bark(?). I am disturbed that I didnt even think about contacting the seller, what an idiot. He seemed to be a decent seller and might have helped me out. I have already lapped a side to try and use but my skill level isnt up to a 1 inch wide hone just yet. I have read in some of your other posts that a way to check the hardness is to let water set on the stone to see how long it takes to absorb. I checked mine and the water set for at least 30 min before I gave up so I could use it. What are the time limits for the diferent scales of hardness? Thanks again for your help.

As far as the barber hone goes I will try the easy off, thanks guys.

Originally Posted by OLD_SCHOOL

The box says "Tradition 17 generation Shouhonyama natural sharpening stone" and "Yamashiro inscription sharpening stone".

The hone itself says "Yamashiro inscription sharpening stone" The first three stamps in the rectangle read "Shouhonyama" the remaining 3 are meaningless. At this point, I cannot speak to the Yamashiro stamp at this point, but the Shouhonyama one is said to be not genuine.



Anyone selling a hone like that and passing it off as a razor hone, is not what I would call a decent seller. But that's just me, and yes I know, I'll get letters.

First off thanks so much OS.

So I am in possession of a counterfit stone with the one stamp not being genuine? I really feel like an idiot since I didnt even contact the seller first before trying my hand at fixing it. Today when I checked his ebay store he does offer returns and picks up the return postage to boot, alot of good that does me now since there are no longer stamps on it. I did send him a message to see what his response is to my problem and I guess we'll see how decent he is. As far as my next stone goes, I have learnt my lesson and will only buy from people that actually have used the stone and can vouch for it so you will probably be seeing me soon. Thanks again.

that is a 330mate stone, if its purchased from his ebay store then do not expect much.
If you are buying from his website then you might be able to find a good stone but you have to know what to look for. Also the guy is very unwilling to try to find you the right stone, so you might be better off with buying a stone from a reputable seller: Ols School, Alex etc.
Quality stones can be pretty expensive though.

P.S.
I just remembered I have seen a suggestion for a fix that might work for you.
As you suggested make a grove where the vein is and then fill with epoxy to be flush with the surface of the stone.