Thread: Beginner stone??

Originally Posted by hoglahoo

I disagree

I agree

Cool, so it balances out.....I just don't like the Norton's anymore, maybe I'm biased.....

Originally Posted by zib

Cool, so it balances out.....I just don't like the Norton's anymore, maybe I'm biased.....

lol - could be

Originally Posted by zib

Yes, they are, but their a better stone. I mean, who likes waiting 30 minutes to hone a razor? Also, Norton requires more lapps, not a good thing for a beginner. You can do a lot of damage with a Norton. A Naniwa 12k is perfect for starting out if you have an already honed blade that just needs touch ups, that and some Crox and your good to go. If I was starting over and knew what I know now, that's the first two things I'd get. I still recommend the Nortons, but I'm thinking, why? I never use mine. I don't even like them anymore...They are collecting dust as they say, I've moved on to bigger and better things..But, yes, they were the first stones I bought based on site recommendations....

If money is an issue, this may not be the hobby for you, because, when you start getting into honing, it starts getting expensive as you well know....

Here's the problem with Knife sharpening and water stones. They tend to be soft, hence they can be cut into easily. Knives require anywhere from 20-30 degree angle depending on what type of knife it is, unlike a razor. I recommend Arkansas for Knives. I guess you could use the Norton's. I never have. I tried sharpening a Ka Bar Marine Knife with a naniwa and cut right into the stone....

Agree with the Naniwa being one of the best stone for sharpening. I have never tried the Nortons, but I had Naniwas and I am completely satisfied how they work.
As far as knife sharpening, its more complicated than you think. First of all, the only set that is proven to work for any steel is the Chosera set, I personally use a mix of Super Stones and Chosera and I get great results.
as far as sharpening angle, well if you sharpen a German clunker then yes ~25 deg is right, if you however sharpen Jpanese knife then things get in the 10-15 deg region.

They tend to be soft, hence they can be cut into easily

if you refer to knives, I disagree. The all so popular Henckels and Whusthofs are in the 54 HRC, but the real deal knives - Japanese made are from 58-67 HRC which is not that soft.

I think the reason the Norton's get recommended is because for beginners, that don't know if they're gonna stick with it, the most economical way is to go with the Norton's.

That and tons of people have used them, so they can give advice.

As for soaking them for 30 minutes, I have never soaked mine that long. I've only ever found it necessary to soak them for 10-15 mins. In fact, IIRC, that's all they recommend on the DVD that came with the starter set.

You wouldn't go and tell a 16y.o. kid that his first car should be a Rolls would ya?

Start with something tried and true, and economical.

Ive used a lot of stones (albeit on single bevel Japanese knives) but I haven't found anything close to the Naniwa Chosera line. The super stones are also very good. Not a fan of Shapton in general, or Norton for that matter...

I am certainly no expert on this stuff, but I have a bit of a different angle. So, I thought I'd share just to put a different spin on this thread.

When I started I bought a Carborundum 101a barber hone and it's been great for the 5 years or so that I've had it.

All of my razors were used when I got them, and only one wasn't vintage. Strangely, the only one that I couldn't get a shave-able edge on was the Dovo "best quality" that I got off of Ebay. It's also my only straight that's not vintage.

The vintage blades keened up quickly with the barber hone.

So, I'd say that a good beginner hone would be a barber hone like the carborundum. I understand that it's somewhere in the 12k range, and so it's a finisher.

I did get a DMT d8ee and for the first time my Dovo is working for me. I still follow it with the 101a, and soon I'll be following that with CrO strop.

Personally, I'd buy a cheap stone for starters. King 6k or 6k/1k combo (a cheap bevel setter later if you decide you need it), or china 12k, or a barber hone. You can snag these for $35 or less, and they should all work fine as a finisher until you feel the need to upgrade.


If you want to start with something that you wont find many people likely to speak ill of, the Naniwa 12k has many experienced supporters and should find use at the very least as a good stage stone in almost any progression you may decide to use later on (if you go that way). Lynn and others have said very nice things about it.

Funny you should ask that question as I was talking to one of our members here on the phone the other day about the same thing...

First off don't buy just the N4/8 the entire starter set goes on Amazon for $118 shipped all the time just search it.. With the whole kit you can sharpen anything really...especially razor wise...
I have never seen a razor that the N1k 4k 8k cant get shaving sharp unless it is bad somehow...

You really don't need anything else, you might want other stuff but you don't need it...

That being said, I usually recommend a Barber's Hone to start, they work, they are cheap, easy, and can be re-sold easily... but in your case you are thinking knife sharpening too so the complete set might be better ...

Originally Posted by gssixgun

You really don't need anything else, you might want other stuff but you don't need it...

+1. I used them exclusively for awhile and got very good results. Having higher grit finishing hones is really the icing on the cake.

I don't use my razor hones for knives though, because Knife sharpening tend to wear the stones faster and I don't like to lap away so much material. For knives and axed it doesn't matter so much if the stone is perfectly even or not.