Thread: Shapton GS 16000

I don't have a Shapton 16k and I don't have a ton of honing experience, but I would suggest that you make sure you can shave off that 8k. I'd heard it from a lot of guys and finally tried it last night. The edge was great! And I bet if you do get a great 8k edge, it won't take much work on the 16k (as others have said) to finish it to where you want. I wouldn't know from personal experience, though....

If you try to make up for a mediocre 8k edge by any finisher, you won't get anywhere. I think I've had enough experience with doing that to give that piece of advice pretty confidently.

This might be completely irrelevant to you, though, if your 8k edges are fine.

Originally Posted by KalgoorlieBoi

So I took the plunge and got a shapton gs16000 for finishing but after a LITTLE playing I realised I have no idea even where to start.
I was wondering If any of you fine people who have or had a gs16000 could share some tricks, experiences info for example I'm still not sure If this is a fast or slow cutter but am pretty sure it's not supposed to glaze up so quick.
anywho thank you in advance.
oh and before the shapton I have a norton 4/8k

I am late to this discussion...
One addition to all the above is to use a thin solution of detergent
with your ultra fine hones. I keep a foaming hand soap handy
next to the kitchen sink. A little bit lets me rinse swarf off
hones and also makes a good honing solution.

Another good cleaner is "simply green" I keep a dilution of
it in a handy spray bottle.

I like detergent because I lightly oil my razors and that tiny little bit of
oil seems to clog the hone but a little detergent wets the hone
and keeps the trace oil from getting in the way.

The jump from an 8k hone to a 16k hone is a bit big. With
the speed of modern hones and good technique it may well
be possible. Since the jump is large and these hones
seem possible of "over honing" a good place to start is with
a couple sets of circles taking advantage of the ends of
the hone. Follow that with 10 perhaps 15 normal light hone
strokes, strop and shave test.

Another point made by others above is that when finished at 8k you should have
a good sharp shaver. It makes sense to shave test your 8K result
and then compare with the change that the 16k gives you. If
the 8k result is not shave sharp then your are not done at 8k and
a revisit to the 4k/8k combo pyramid method makes sense.

Originally Posted by niftyshaving

I am late to this discussion...
One addition to all the above is to use a thin solution of detergent
with your ultra fine hones. I keep a foaming hand soap handy
next to the kitchen sink. A little bit lets me rinse swarf off
hones and also makes a good honing solution.

Another good cleaner is "simply green" I keep a dilution of
it in a handy spray bottle.

I like detergent because I lightly oil my razors and that tiny little bit of
oil seems to clog the hone but a little detergent wets the hone
and keeps the trace oil from getting in the way.

The jump from an 8k hone to a 16k hone is a bit big. With
the speed of modern hones and good technique it may well
be possible. Since the jump is large and these hones
seem possible of "over honing" a good place to start is with
a couple sets of circles taking advantage of the ends of
the hone. Follow that with 10 perhaps 15 normal light hone
strokes, strop and shave test.

Another point made by others above is that when finished at 8k you should have
a good sharp shaver. It makes sense to shave test your 8K result
and then compare with the change that the 16k gives you. If
the 8k result is not shave sharp then your are not done at 8k and
a revisit to the 4k/8k combo pyramid method makes sense.

thank you, thats great advise.
I'll try to report back by the end of the weekend, I'm gonna give it a go tonight.
wish me luck

Originally Posted by niftyshaving

I am late to this discussion...
One addition to all the above is to use a thin solution of detergent
with your ultra fine hones. I keep a foaming hand soap handy
next to the kitchen sink. A little bit lets me rinse swarf off
hones and also makes a good honing solution.

Another good cleaner is "simply green" I keep a dilution of
it in a handy spray bottle.

Shapton makes a point to say not to use detergent on their hones, saying that detergents could damage it. I don't know if its over caution on their part, I've never done it, Shaptons arent cheap.

I use mine as part of a 1/4/8/16k progression and it works well. I'm not a massive fan of the Shapton edges, I find them a little harsh, but what works well is building a slight slurry with a 325 DMT (a method I got from Glen) which softens the edge some. If it was my only finisher, thats how I'd use it all the time.

I dont do many strokes either. Once I come off the 4k I tend to do 20 strokes on the 8k and then 10-20 on the 16k depending on how hard the steel is. If the razor was a bear to hone on the low grits I tend to do 20 on the 16k. If it was really easy I only do 10.

TBH I usually stop at 8k and use a natural stone as a finisher as I prefer the edges they give to a synthetic.

Originally Posted by Stubear

I use mine as part of a 1/4/8/16k progression and it works well. I'm not a massive fan of the Shapton edges, I find them a little harsh, but what works well is building a slight slurry with a 325 DMT (a method I got from Glen) which softens the edge some. If it was my only finisher, thats how I'd use it all the time.

I dont do many strokes either. Once I come off the 4k I tend to do 20 strokes on the 8k and then 10-20 on the 16k depending on how hard the steel is. If the razor was a bear to hone on the low grits I tend to do 20 on the 16k. If it was really easy I only do 10.

TBH I usually stop at 8k and use a natural stone as a finisher as I prefer the edges they give to a synthetic.

Stu makes an excellent point here. You don't need many strokes at the end. Once you set a proper bevel, it truly is the foundation for eveything to follow. 10-20 strokes is pretty much what I do under most circumstances following the 1k....

Of course, Coticules being the exception...

Originally Posted by Pete_S

Shapton makes a point to say not to use detergent on their hones, saying that detergents could damage it. I don't know if its over caution on their part, I've never done it, Shaptons arent cheap.

Thanks ... it pays to read the vendor instructions.

I would note that when I say detergent I am only adding
the smallest amount to cut the surface tension. And
I always rinse the hone clean...

The guys at the below link have translated the instructions for
a lot of different hones, missing is shapton-glass hones.

Japanese Waterstones: Shapton

The comment on not soaking Chosera hones is interesting.

Japanese Waterstones: Naniwa Chosera

I use the slighttest amounts of dish soap in mine as well (one drop to a bowl of water) for the same reasons (trace amounts of oil on the blades) and have not had any negative effects on mine since the first of August, but the little slip of paper that came with each of my GS's says not to.

Originally Posted by shooter74743

I use the slighttest amounts of dish soap in mine as well (one drop to a bowl of water) for the same reasons (trace amounts of oil on the blades) and have not had any negative effects on mine since the first of August, but the little slip of paper that came with each of my GS's says not to.

I am now very curious why Shapton gives this instruction.
Since they know a lot about their hones I would follow
the directions.

Is this only for the GS hones or for all Shapton's?

I'm sure they know much more about their stones than I, however my thoughts is that a little soap (a drop in a bowl) can't be much worse than tap water that has quite a bit of chlorine and God knows what else in it.

If they were that worried about it, they would have recommended distilled water...

What works for me may not work for someone else & I'm not suggesting it considering their price. This just works for me...
Scott