Thread: Help with honing.

Unless you just want to spend some money (which is fun to do), you can also just go to the hardware store and get a coarse/fine silicon carbide stone (around $10.00) and some aluminum oxide stropping compound (about $3.00). Sharpen the razor on the stone, then rub the compound on a piece of of leather (a cast off piece of belt, etc.) or cardboard and strop the razor on it lightly (wipe the blade clean afterward). Strop on your everyday canvas then leather and you're razor will be ready to shave.

Originally Posted by JeffR

Unless you just want to spend some money (which is fun to do), you can also just go to the hardware store and get a coarse/fine silicon carbide stone (around $10.00) and some aluminum oxide stropping compound (about $3.00). Sharpen the razor on the stone, then rub the compound on a piece of of leather (a cast off piece of belt, etc.) or cardboard and strop the razor on it lightly (wipe the blade clean afterward). Strop on your everyday canvas then leather and you're razor will be ready to shave.

A couple of good reasons not to use this method:
Destructive on your razor & the least smooth on your face.

Originally Posted by fifthmanstanding

Lets assume that I want to build a set of stones and necessary accessories. What would that laundry list be?

I'm surfing a lot of craigslist for shapton stones. What should I look for or be wary of in used stones?

I could be wrong but I think shapton makes many different lines. If I were looking for shaptons I would make sure to get either glass-stone or pro, because these are used for razors by experienced members. Glass stone is cheaper

Michael

The more recent version for you
Some thoughts on honing razors..
Aspiring honers are often not clear about what they are trying to accomplish when it comes to honing razors. In particular, they are often unsure of what they are doing and how often they should be doing it. Some questions you might want to answer for yourself before you start buying hones: this also means that if you are not sure of the answer here, you should shave more, and wait to buy hones until you can answer these questions.... I normally recommend 6 months of shaving before even thinking about honing

■ Are you an "end-user"; someone who only hones a previously shave-ready blade back to shave-ready?
■ Are you a hobbyist who is chasing the absolute finest edge that may be obtained where money is no object?
■ Are you a frugal shaver who is after the cheapest way to complete your morning shave?
■ Are you a collector who needs to take E-bay specials from butt-ugly to shave-ready?
■ Are you a Honemiester; someone who gets paid to do all of these things for others?
■ Are you a razor restorer who needs to take damaged blades and bring them back to life and shave-readiness?

Each of these types of honer profiles have different requirements for the stones they will own. Theoretically, you can survive using the "one stone" approach, but each razor does have an optimum stone set - and more importantly, a technique for using the required hones. So generally, when somebody asks what stone or how to use what stone, the question to ask them is: "What are you trying to accomplish with the stone(S)?"

Refreshing vs. Starting from Scratch:

The types of hones required depends first and foremost on the type of honing you want to do.

Hones needed for refreshing a dull blade:

If the only task you want to perform is refreshing edges that have previously been established by a Honemiester (the process is often referred to as "touching up"), you need only get a fine grit finishing stone or a barber's hone for this. Either of these hones can be used to keep your razor(s) shave-ready for years.

Hones needed for restoring razors:

If you want to set a bevel, or have many different types of razors, you will need a full set of hones.


A bevel setting stone approximately 1k

DMT's 325 600 1200, Shapton 500, 1K and 2K, Coticules with slurry, Norton 1k, Naniwa 1k, King 1k Chosera 1k

A sharpening stone approximately 4k

Norton 4K, Shapton 4K Naniwa 3k or 5k, Belgian Blue with slurry, Coticule with slurry, King 4k or 6k Tam o Shanter, Dragon's Tongue

A polishing stone approximately 8k

Norton 8k, Shapton 8k, Naniwa 8k, Yellow Coticule, Water of Ayre, Llyn Melynllyn, Some of the Japanese Naturals

A finishing stone 10k and above (this is often subject to debate, however)

Shapton GS 16k-30k Shapton 15k Naniwa SS 10k-12k or Chosera 10k, Thuringens, Escher's, Many different natural Japanese finishers, Charlney Forest, Extra Fine Coticule, even some of the Arkansas stones... (keep in mind there are many more but these are the more accessible one)


You have several choices of how to accomplish this setup whether you use natural, man-made stone, or a Diamond-style stone, even Lapping films, but you are going to have to be able to cover those 4 grit ranges. There really is no true shortcut here if you expect to take razors acquired in need of restoration from butter knife dull (or damaged) to shaving sharp: You are going to end up needing these types of stones.


Pastes can be used after the hones and before the final stropping also these can be used for re-freshing the edge before going back to the hones for a touch-up... Some shavers even use pastes to "sharpen" the razor after the bevel set has been done...

A few different types

Dovo Pastes:

Green 5-8 micron
Red 3-5 micron
Black 1-3 micron
Dovo pastes are a much more mild cutter then say a diamond paste of the same micron size...

Diamond Paste:

From 3 micron down to actually .10 micron if you really wanted to...
These pastes are fast and many people use them incorrectly and manage too get a harsh edge, when used correctly and on the right razor steel these will most likely be the sharpest edge you will ever feel...

Diamond sprays:

Mostly found in 1.0 .50 and .25 micron watch the Carat content here, the higher the better (SRD has the best I have found and yes Lynn and Don are friends of mine, but heck it is still the best spray I have found)

Chromium Oxide Paste/Powder .50 micron (CrOx)
Probably the most universal of the pastes, get the most pure you can find, and no the bars at Woodcrafters are not pure...

Cerium Oxide Paste/Powder (approx).25 micron (CeOx)

Super fine, super soft, and super smooth, polishing media...The bar at Woodcrafter's is of unknown quality at this time

Other Pastes and Powders:

Iron Oxide
Aluminum Oxide

Both of these can also be used again be very careful when buying this stuff as the purity and the micron sizes are very important...

Carbon blacking/lamp black:

This might be the oldest of all the sharpening "pastes" when used on a leather strop it increases draw

Wood Ash:

Another old fashioned one very slightly abrasive when used on Linen strops and Leather strops..

White chalk:

Can be rubbed on a linen strop to increase the abrasive qualities

Newspaper:

The ink itself is a very fine abrasive and so is the paper..

Cubic Boron Nitride (CBN)

The newest of the patses being used right now the .10 is the most popular, a very slick addition to a stone or stone to smooth out an edge


Keep in mind that different razor steels like/dislike different pastes, and the different media that is used to apply it including Balsa, Linen, Leather (paddle) Leather (hanger) and Felt paddle and hanger all give different results on different razor steels....


The above are only my personal opinions and observations... There are no set rules in Razordom

Naniwa chosera 1K & Norton 4/8k or Naniwa 3/8K, enough said.

Once you get those down & your finances recover, follow them up with a Naniwa 12K when your skills master those three "grits".

The Chosera 1K is in most all veteran honer's arsenal, I really don't think there is a better stone for bevel setting. Yes, it's a little pricey, but most definitely worth it.

Lastly, my opinion counts as I have owned and used what I am recommending for you.

I personally use Shapton GS's, but really don't think they should be the first stones for a person learning to hone. The Naniwa & Norton's are more forgiving.

Originally Posted by onimaru55

A couple of good reasons not to use this method:
Destructive on your razor & the least smooth on your face.

Respectfully, I have not found either assertion to be the case.

Originally Posted by gssixgun

The more recent version for you
Some questions you might want to answer for yourself before you start buying hones: this also means that if you are not sure of the answer here, you should shave more, and wait to buy hones until you can answer these questions.... I normally recommend 6 months of shaving before even thinking about honing

■ Are you an "end-user"; someone who only hones a previously shave-ready blade back to shave-ready?
■ Are you a hobbyist who is chasing the absolute finest edge that may be obtained where money is no object?
■ Are you a frugal shaver who is after the cheapest way to complete your morning shave?
■ Are you a collector who needs to take E-bay specials from butt-ugly to shave-ready?
■ Are you a Honemiester; someone who gets paid to do all of these things for others?
■ Are you a razor restorer who needs to take damaged blades and bring them back to life and shave-readiness?

Man that is a tough one. I'm an ex-metalsmith (whitesmithing) who dabbled in blacksmithing and appreciates metal and the project of restoring, enhancing and altering anything that is metal. I'm a hobbyist shaver who appreciates good edge and good shave. I'm a frugal shaver who's been using straights for about 5-6 years now (I remember when SRP was a yahoo board) and I'm tired of paying for honing (I appreciate the service but I really just like doing things myself) and like the idea of having the stones handy.

I don't really see much razor restoration going on the near future though I do like the idea.

But for now, yes, touching up or sharpening.


I was looking to buy a used Norton set of 3 stones like this for $75 from a guy.

and one of these as a finisher Chinese 12k water stone

any thoughts on those?

Originally Posted by fifthmanstanding

I was looking to buy a used Norton set of 3 stones like this for $75 from a guy. and one of these as a finisher Chinese 12k water stoneany thoughts on those?

That set-up would be great for anything you wanted to do, from restoring to simple touch up's. Beware though, not all of the Chinese stones are the same. They can range from worthless rocks to incredibly fine finishers. Luckily they are cheap enough that you can take a chance on one or two of them.

This used set of Norton's doesn't come with the flattening stone. Is it still worth $75? and is there a work around or would I be ok using a harder stone?

A lot of folks are leery of the flattening stone anyway, since it too needs to be flattened. Get a DMT 325-grit plate and those other Nortons and you'll have the plain-vanilla honing setup. Scads of folks here hone on the very same stones, so you'll have access to limitless first-person advice. The DMT 325 is what you'll flatten the other hones with. There are other diamond hones, some costlier and some cheaper. I had one of the cheaper ones for a day, but discovered that it was not flat. I've never heard of a DMT that wasn't flat.

So if you can still get those used Nortons and trust that they're in good shape, add the DMT for ~$80 more, start with a junker blade, and get honing! A new Norton 4/8k is probably around $80 also.

Good luck and best wishes