Thread: New Shapton high carbon stones

Does anyone know anything about these stones. I got a 2,4, and 8k in a stone deal and can't really find any Info. about them.
Stingray

Those came out a few years ago. There was info on So Yamashita's site and on the Shapton USA site. IIRC they are gray and where the white glass stones are for one tool steel the gray are for the other. Referring to the Japanese "white" steel and "blue" steel IIRC. Lynn told me they are good and about the same as the other glass stones IIRC. Harellson Stanley is the distributor for Shapton in the USA. He participates in the woodworking forum and you can probably find out about them there.

Japanese Woodworking Forums • Index page

more about them here ;

http://hmsenterprises.com/webstore/h...es/shapton.php

Like Jimmy said, not so new. They may make the whole range of grits. My 220 grit GS is grey.

There was a bit of a review here :
http://straightrazorpalace.com/hones...h-carbons.html

Are they gray only in the japanese market? What about the higher grit ranges, is there a difference between one stone vs. another?

A friend of mine got the glasstones before there was anything but one, and a vendor then sent me a 16k HC line stone, and it was the same part number as a buddy's 16k and it was white. I couldn't tell any difference.

The only difference for me in using the Grey or High Carbon Shapton Glass Stones is that I feel a little more feedback from the stones. The results or virtually the same and very consistent.

Have fun.

Originally Posted by DaveW

Are they gray only in the japanese market? What about the higher grit ranges, is there a difference between one stone vs. another?

A friend of mine got the glasstones before there was anything but one, and a vendor then sent me a 16k HC line stone, and it was the same part number as a buddy's 16k and it was white. I couldn't tell any difference.

IIRC it has to do with the Japanese white steel and blue steel. These things are made primarily for tool sharpening. There is a market of guys who are as enthusiastic about their plane and chisel blades as we are about our straight razors.

So there are subtle differences between the white glass and the gray. Lynn told me, I asked him just a couple of weeks ago, that they are real close. Both very good. A friend of mine asked me to hone a couple of his razors on the glass stones (white) and brought his over. He wanted to compare his efforts with the stones/razors with mine.

I had never honed with glass stones before. I liked them so much I'm tempted to buy a 4/8/16 set. I really liked the feel of the steel on the hones. I don't use tape so I am more sensitive of the feel than when I did use it. They worked really well on the two high carbon blades my friend brought. That experience was what prompted me to ask Lynn about the gray glass stones.

I'm not sure what the difference is in the abrasive and the binder in those stones, but blue steel shouldn't be a problem for either one.

I can't remember what their marketing commentary was, and in razors the thinness of the glasstones isn't a big deal, but in tools, especially on the 1000, it's a big problem and getting 5mm of abrasive instead of 15 is a real hoax.

At any rate, it's interesting that they would make two ceramic alumina stones that are practically the same thing with the same particle sizes and describe one as being better for carbon steels vs. the other being for general use. I use their pros as woodworking stones. they softened the 1000 glasstone to make it appear like it was a faster abrasive, and thirded the thickness, which caused a lot of negative attention from woodworkers being told that they could just buy a new stone every few years and not worry about it.

But we are all aware here that the difference in carbon steel vs. alloyed steel passes a much greater divide in abrasives hardness and sharpness (depth of cut) than the possible difference between the aluminas, binders, and possibly density, and if people are consciously thinking about it, they'll notice their highly alloyed razors play a lot less nice with eschers and jnats than do their razors with simpler steel. So for shapton to release a stone that has super hard and durable ceramic alumina and then release another stone that has super hard and durable ceramic alumina and call one of them high carbon and the other one not, I'm really confused (well, more like cynical).

As a flag waving shapton pro user for tools, I wish instead that they would've released a different pro stone instead of two very similar glasstones.

The real divide between high carbon and everything else lies in the natural silica / novaculite types vs. the ceramic aluminas on up through diamonds, even the "high carbon" shapton will probably cut every common carbide in tool and razor steels, despite the name implying that it might not be appropriate.

I'd imagine also that there are probably a lot of people who use a natural stone on an alloyed razor and they don't notice that the stone comes up a little short, because they're finishing with a powder or paste that has no problem with the carbides.

Originally Posted by DaveW

I'd imagine also that there are probably a lot of people who use a natural stone on an alloyed razor and they don't notice that the stone comes up a little short, because they're finishing with a powder or paste that has no problem with the carbides.

I'm not an expert on the finer distinctions of finishing stone composition, nor on which might be better for one steel as opposed to another. Aside from pocket knives once in awhile on Arkansas stones I only have sharpened razors. With those everything from vintage Sheffields, Solingens, to ATS-34 and S-30V.

For finishing I do prefer the Escher. A noted honer told me that the Escher, or a coticule fine enough for finishing is best approached after the razor is at the 12k level or above. Saying this to say .... if he is correct .... and I'm not saying he is .... that may be why guys who use naturals for their finishing can achieve the results they are looking for without utilizing pastes and such.

Was the S30V in a razor?

Originally Posted by DaveW

Was the S30V in a razor?

Yeah, Robert Williams built a few years back. I have a 6/8 and a 7/8. Both good and interesting to hone.