Thread: Tape

Yannis, the change of geometry is so small that it doesn't really affect the razor's performance. It's only by a small part of a degree and various razors are ground with greater variations (of up to 5 degrees, maybe even more). 17 degrees is just a general guideline. 15 or 20 would still take on a good shaving edge as long as the steel is hard and fine-grained enough.

I find that new guys honing usually only tape because they wear down the spines so much trying to get an edge. It really is not necessary on most blades. It does work when you want to preserve a design or if you really intend to remove alot of metal as when you have a chipped edge. Electric tape is very sturdy.

Ilija, I don't know where you came up with your angles, but 17 is pretty steep.

Have fun.

Lynn

Originally Posted by adjustme69

17 is pretty steep.

Nope, that's in the ballpark. Most razors I've measured have been between 15 and 19 degrees.

First three I grabbed at random:

5/8 Clauss Barber's Special (mint):
0.65" by 0.18".
ATAN(0.18/0.65) = 15.5 degrees

6/8 Henckels Friodur (new, honed once):
0.75" by 0.24".
ATAN(0.24/0.75) = 17.74

6/8 Robeson Shuredge (NOS, honed once):
0.73" by 0.23"
ATAN(0.23/0.73) = 17.48

8/8 Wade & Butcher "Celebrated Razor for Barber's Use":
0.97" by 0.31"
ATAN(0.31/0.97) = 17.72

For computing the angle, only the distance from the edge to the wear mark on the spine matters. If you mistakenly measure from the edge to back of spine then most of these wind up in the 12-15 degree range.

I never had spine weardown issues. I use the tape just when cleaning up the edge. Once I finish on the 1k (for REALLY dull and/or damaged edges) and do a few strokes on the 4k, I take off the tape and do my regular honing without it. As for the angles... I remember that part from somewhere else, but Razor Central also confirms my statement:

An edge should not chip off during adequate usage. Thin, weak and small-angled edges can handle delicate objects. The razor's 15-20* edge is an ideal compromise between sharpness and strength.

I do have one concern with using the tape, which is why I don't use it for final honing. It's a soft material and flexes a bit, so it doesn't yield sufficient precision for my honing skills.

Originally Posted by FiReSTaRT

...It's a soft material and flexes a bit...

Don't you use chrome oxide on a leather-covered bench hone for your final step? If so then the tape flexing doesn't matter since you're getting a lot more rounding from the bench hone anyway.

Originally Posted by mparker762

Don't you use chrome oxide on a leather-covered bench hone for your final step? If so then the tape flexing doesn't matter since you're getting a lot more rounding from the bench hone anyway.

?????? Can you elaborate on this? Why does a bench hone round?

What is this, a honemiester convention in this thread?

When using a bench hone, both the edge and the spine are on a flexible service. When using tape, only the spine is. I may be a bit unreasonable here, but we all have our little quirks. If Randy can hone up a blade all the way with tape on the spine, who am I to say it can't be done. I am just not comfortable with it.

Originally Posted by AFDavis11

?????? Can you elaborate on this? Why does a bench hone round?

What Ilija said. I also think that because the fin is also flexible it doesn't sink into the leather, but this simply means that the pastes backcut the fin so it weakens and eventually breaks off. My experience with traditional leather-covered paddles or bench hones is that after more than a dozen laps on the chrome oxide the edge gets duller, which I interpret to mean the original fin is collapsing. With a hardwood paddle this doesn't seem to happen - the blade gets a bit sharper and then it levels off, and repeated stropping on the paddle doesn't seem to make things any worse for a long time - it takes many hundreds of laps to overhone a razor at 50k grit :-)

This is one reason I've been a fan of hardwood paddles, though I've had a devil of a time dealing with warping. But the vellum-on-tile paddles I've made recently seem to work about as well but without the warping problem. Vellum is translucent rawhide made from calfskin or lambskin, and very thin and hard: about the same thickness as index card paper but a lot stiffer. Part of its preparation involves scraping it until it's evenly translucent throughout, so it's extremely flat as well. These vellum-on-tile paddles sound like hones when you're stropping (clack-swish-clack-swish) because the vellum is so thin and hard.

Edit: You can actually go edge-leading on these hones, though I haven't tried the resulting edge so it may not be an improvement (and may make them duller). But there's so little distortion that the blades don't catch at all when you run them edge-forward down the hone.

I can do two dozen without dulling. 20ish is the optimum number of passes when I finish on the leather bench hone. Sometimes I do a couple of shave-tests and then another 5-10 passes, before putting it into the rotation or shipping it out.