Thread: blade not as sharp after first shave off stones

been struggling to get a consistent edge from my 1,5 and 8 k Naniwa. the thing i've noticed is that the first shave off the hones feels like it's effortlessly cutting the whiskers. subsequent shaves more effort and more tugging. can't tell much difference if any looking through the loupe. any suggestions?

Well my first thought is that you have a stropping issue, however you have been around long enough that I doubt that to be the issue. My next thought train is are your edges starting to break down very quickly for too much time on the hones. I am not the most experienced guy around, but I would expect if you go too far honing that the edge should look fuzzy at 30X magnification and the shave would be prickly for lack of better words. It could also be a pressure issue on the low grits leading to a fragile edge. I will be interested in what those with more experience say and how it resolves for you.

I thought of stropping too but i do strop right after honing and it does seem to improve the edge (at least by the HHT). I suspect too much time on the hones to be a problem though or too much pressure (i feel that if i used any less it would't touch the stone at all though). It's all just a guessing game for me. I'll try and get a picture later tonight with my usb scope and see if that reveals anything.

Do you have another razor that you can put through the same progression,,, a razor with a similar grind?

Originally Posted by Hirlau

Do you have another razor that you can put through the same progression,,, a razor with a similar grind?

seems to be the same with any razor, full hollow, wedge to quarter hollow. i've just started to realize this problem as i started to shave with one razor instead of rotating them. I've also tried pyramid method as i was afraid of over honing, but got the same results.

here are some images at 200x.

Its hard to find your issue from what we have in this thread, you already know this,,,the magnification can reveal it or lead you on a ghost chase,,,, based on what we have here, if I were in your shoes, I would pick my best razor, start again at the 1k,,, work through the 8k strop & shave again,,, I assume you are finishing on the 8k , as you mentioned no other stone.

take a breather away from the honing for 1 day,,, then bring your best razor up from the 1k,,, forget about over-honing it,,, just go back to your basics of bringing a razor to shave ready. Try stropping before each shave, on your new edge.

I would go from the 8K to paste or diamond spray, next would be forty laps on leather. I see lots of scratches on the edge coming off the 8K stone.

Even better would be a 12k or 16k finishing stone.

Originally Posted by tintin

I thought of stropping too but i do strop right after honing and it does seem to improve the edge (at least by the HHT). I suspect too much time on the hones to be a problem though or too much pressure (i feel that if i used any less it would't touch the stone at all though). It's all just a guessing game for me. I'll try and get a picture later tonight with my usb scope and see if that reveals anything.

First and foremost, I'm not a fan of sprays and pastes, after 5 years I'm just now experimenting with (1) pasted strop. Second I'm not a fan of the USB Microscopes (in the hands of someone who doesn't have enough experience to understand the subtle differences)

Now with that said, I'd like you to try this;

Hone a razor that seems to be giving you the most problems 'after' shaving right off of the hone and then with the next stropping.

Then do your typical pre-shave prep and shave 1/2 of your face. Yes just half of it.

Then re-strop your razor and have a go with the other 1/2. If you need to re-lather that's OK.

Did it shave as well?? Yes/No/Maybe So?

If it did as well, then rinse wash dry it and then oil it and put it away until the next shave then Strop it and do you typical pre-shave and use it again.

Same as before? Yes/No/Maybe So?

Then you will have something to gauge by.

I hope this is of some help.

What brand and grind is the razor?
What is the condition of the spine?
Was this a touch up or a breadknife/ repair/ re-honing?
What does the edge look like, when viewed straight down on the edge?

A photo may help.

It does sound like your edge is breaking down post shaving and stropping. Normally caused by a very steep/thin angle, bad steel, bevel setting with too much pressure or with low grit aggressive hones, lifting the spine when stropping, with too much pressure, or the strop is contaminated.

Deep stria is present on the bevel in random directions.
I would lightly joint the edge on the corner of the 8K stone. Tape the spine and do 2 sets of 20 laps with lite pressure.
Jointing and finish honing with an extra layer of tape will get an edge on it, what happened next will determine your next step.

Take a photo pre and post stropping and compare.