Thread: Are You A Real Man? Do You Think You Can Hone? Shave Off Of Your 1k Hone

Your experience kind of mirrors the epiphany I had a couple of pages back doing this experiment with my Chosera-I literally could not believe what a great smooth shave it was. To your questions about the most important factors, I believe a little of all of the above played into it.

But my opinion, at least for me, I believe that just spending a little more time and care in inspecting and refining the edge on that 1k bevel setter (or whichever one you use) makes most of the difference, and lays the foundation for going up the grits. With that experiment and since, I have started doing maybe 20-25 ultralight "finishing strokes" and then stropping before moving up-makes all the difference.

Roy/Cudarunner often recommends test-shaving off of the hone, stropping on your linen component and testing again, and then testing a final time after the leather to get an education in what each stage is doing. This makes perfect sense to me. Congrats on your results!

Originally Posted by Sdm84

Now here are my questions- does this mean I have a good understanding of the basics of honing?

Yes, right up until you run into a problem with another blade! They always are out there, making you humble again!

Originally Posted by Sdm84

Is it a combination of honing, stropping, shaving technique that leads to a good shave (all work together) or is there one element that is more important than another?

After today I am convinced that it is the shave that matters- that is the one and only criteria of a good edge.

Of course the entire goal of this process is a great shave, but I believe that all three elements must come into play for that shave.

Originally Posted by Utopian

It certainly counts if that is what you use to set a bevel.

Yes, stropping can make up for some roughness off the hone, but the big lesson here is that if the bevels are not set, then stropping ain't gonna fix that.

Actually, for "bevel setting" (aka "sharpening) I'll use pretty much whatever's handy. But admittedly, I don't hone lots of razors as a hobby. I only have three, and after getting them honed to my liking I've only needed to strop them to keep them ready to shave.

I very much agree with you about getting the bevels set as being essential. Kind of hard to have any kind of sharp edge if the two bevels don't meet.

Did this by accident once with a similar stone - a very coarse slate that someone gave me. I wanted to try to shave off of it, anyway, and it did shave, but it was pretty rough. I shaved my face and the back of my neck after cutting my hair, and the next day at work, someone said "what happened to your neck?" since the area was so irritated that you could still see it.

I enjoy a smooth shave too much to do it again. I have often shaved straight off of a finisher just to see what it was like, though (no linen and leather), and even that is still a bit rough.

In my mind, once you know how to hone, trying to get the 1k stone to do the work of the next stone or the finishing stone to do the work of a strop, etc, is a waste of time.

No one is suggesting that anyone should chuck the rest of their hones. The point is that it can be a learning experience to find out how good of a shave, without irritation, can be achieved off of the 1k. Understanding what the 1k can do can help honers learn to better prepare the edge for the hones that follow.

I get that part, but I've never been sold on it making someone a better honer aside from the folks who have not built up the perception to know when they've set a clean edge.

If the edge is a bit coarse (wire edge, deep grooves, etc from not having a light touch) but there are two or three more stones to be used after the 1k, then it really doesn't matter if you can shave off of it.

Regardless, if it does help someone figure something out, that's fine. It's a bad particle and groove shape for early shaving, though - something like a washita arkansas is just as good as a 1k synthetic, but it can actually provide a comfortable shave and not an "oh well, I proved I could do it".

It's sort of like the insistence on some threads that you need to be able to catch standing hair on your arm after the 1k - that edge isn't even going to be on the razor after the next few stones in the progression, and doing that won't make any difference in final sharpening.

Originally Posted by DaveW

I get that part, but I've never been sold on it making someone a better honer aside from the folks who have not built up the perception to know when they've set a clean edge.

I think these are the people mostly targeted by a challenge like this one. Demonstrate for new honers what a clean, well set edge can do. And if they followed through, see what it's capable of doing off each hone in their progression. At least that's what I got from it.

Dave, I completely get, and agree with, your point. Yes, subsequent hones can make up for a less than perfect edge off of the 1k. This is exactly why I almost always follow a 1k hone with either a 1.5 or 2k hone.

You are right. It is not necessary to get the absolute best edge off of the 1k when it is going to be followed by another hone, as long as that 1k edge is at least in the ballpark of adequate. The thing is, we all have seen the opposite many many times. That is, when the bevels are not adequately set and then, after going through a full progression, the razor does not shave at all.

This challenge really is geared toward those who do not have a proper appreciation/understanding of what each hone can do. In theory, I already know this, but I feel that I continue to benefit from experimenting with this stuff too.

Well as one of "those people" I can tell you I got my eyes opened with this exercise. And yes, I am continuing to shave off each stone. I have learned much from this and also improved my stropping immensely.

Just remember everyone starts somewhere and learns. Just because it is "easy" for one person it may not be "easy" for someone just starting out.

I am a jazz musician and can solo over changes on my trumpet by ear easily. It would be easy for me to say to someone- "it goes like this now you do it" and just pick them apart. It is silly for me to think a beginning trumpet student can do what I can do. I have paid my dues on my horn and am now paying my dues on the hones.


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Originally Posted by Sdm84

I am a jazz musician and can solo over changes on my trumpet by ear easily. It would be easy for me to say to someone- "it goes like this now you do it" and just pick them apart. It is silly for me to think a beginning trumpet student can do what I can do. I have paid my dues on my horn and am now paying my dues on the hones.

I'm far from a beginning trumpet player, but I never learned jazz improvisation. I've always wanted to learn but never have done anything about it. I keep seeming to find other priorities.