Thread: 'X' Pattern

Originally Posted by GoTeeGuy

That may explain why honing in an 'X' pattern does not produce an uneven blade. If the pressure on the heal is greater than that on the point, then the heal may simply not require as much honing, while the point still benefits from the extra 'travel' along the hone.

- Ken -

Maybe this explains why barber hones were made the size that we find them.

Considering that the point should not go below the mid point on the hone, the heel and point actually travel about the same distance on the hone when using the standard 2" wide barber hone and the classic X pattern. And the usual length of a straight razor blade is about 3". If you are using a wider (maybe not straight razor specific) hone, or using a straight across honing technique, this may not apply.

During performance of the X pattern, as the point of the razor is starting to contact the hone, the heel is exiting the bottom edge of the hone. Only if you continue to draw the point past the middle of the hone (longest, or horizontal, axis) will it get more contact time (so, dont - ) .

The real trick in honing is learning to keep equal pressure and flat contact all along the edge on both sides. The test for this is the thumb nail. If you find that sharpness is uneven along the edge (sharp heel, duller point, etc.), then you weren't applying equal pressure and/or keeping the razor flat the entire stroke.

Thoughts??

Scott

Originally Posted by honedright

Maybe this explains why barber hones were made the size that we find them.
Thoughts??

Scott

Exactly my thought...

Nenad

For those of you who employ the "rolling hone/variable pressure" method, do you typically use one hand, or two?

Andrew

Originally Posted by honedright

Actually the manuals recommend honing the heel, point and center with special emphasis at each section but at all times keeping the razor flat, but not all attempted during a single X patern stroke.

In other words, first you emphasize (with more pressure) honing at just the heel with 4 short X pattern strokes on each side, then you reposition the razor so that the point can be honed 4 times on each side with short X strokes, then reposition the razor again and hone the entire blade lightly X pattern style so that the center gets some attention.


I think the problem I am perceiving is that this "rolling" method, as suggested, seems to involve lifting the back, or spine, of the razor up and away from the hone during part of the stroke and that seems incorrect. And I still caution any noobies, who may have interpreted the "rolling honing" as I did, against lifting the spine while honing. If that is not how this honing method is meant to be done, then I stand corrected.

Scott

Okay, I think I've got it!!!

Maybe this word, "rolling" triped us(noobe's) up a bit. You old timers must remember that us new guys don't know Sh*t! So when you use words of phrazes that you think we all know, we don't.

This will help me tremendously when trying to extablish a bevel that differs greatly from one end of the razor to the other. For some reason, and I don't know why, the heel seems to present the biggest fault along the entire line of the bevel when there are "uneven" problems.

That you XMAN, Jimbo, Scott,and everyone else. I have just taken a huge step forward in my knowledge of honing.

Regards,

Steve

Originally Posted by honedright

...

The real trick in honing is learning to keep equal pressure and flat contact all along the edge on both sides. The test for this is the thumb nail. If you find that sharpness is uneven along the edge (sharp heel, duller point, etc.), then you weren't applying equal pressure and/or keeping the razor flat the entire stroke.

Thoughts??

Scott

Well, I'm with you on the equal pressure idea, defnitely. But I'm wondering whether flat contact is the only way to achieve even pressure.

I've got no experience with the really narrow hones - is there no weight-tranference (even subtley) at the shank as the middle-to-toe area of the edge comes in contact with the hone?

James.

Originally Posted by Jimbo

Well, I'm with you on the equal pressure idea, defnitely. But I'm wondering whether flat contact is the only way to achieve even pressure.

I've got no experience with the really narrow hones - is there no weight-tranference (even subtley) at the shank as the middle-to-toe area of the edge comes in contact with the hone?

James.

Probably there is. There are leverage changes too...and that is the challenge to, and the skill of honing, to overcome and manually correct those tendencies. Subtle though they may be.

Those who are exceptionally dexterous (think - neuro surgeons, watch makers, etc.) will probably become better at honing than those who are maybe less gifted, but I think anyone who puts the time and effort into it can become proficient at the skill.


Scott

PS - One thing I think that helps is what I mentioned before about not letting the point travel past the mid point on the hone. The more blade that remains in contact with the hone, the more stable it will be and easier to control. Still a challenge though....

Oh, and one other thing - if the straight across method on a wide hone is the most stable, and possibly easier method, does it produce a better edge (parallel striations)? Do the the diagonal striations created by the X pattern provide the better cutting edge? And if you perform the X pattern on a wider hone, then are you more likely to get more contact time on the point as opposed to the heel? ???

Oh yes, and why the thumb nail? Because the thumb nail lays over, and is attached to, one of the most exquisitely sensitive goups of sensory nerve endings in the body. A razor blade can be moved over the nail without pain nor risk of injury allowing you to feel the condition of the honed (not stropped) edge with great accuracy. Oh yeah, go ahead and check it with your face instead....(please don't).

Originally Posted by zepplin

... trying to extablish a bevel ...

I like that I think I'm going to write henceforward uxing an x in place of an s. Xoundx like a new character quirk.

X

Originally Posted by xman

I like that I think I'm going to write henceforward uxing an x in place of an s. Xoundx like a new character quirk.

X

Thatx exactly what I wax thinking. Nicexxxxx.....

I'm really new to all this, but have bought myself the 3 inch Norton 4k/8k in order to avoid having to master the X pattern, as I figured that it wouldn't be necessary on this wider hone.

Is that right? Can I just go up and down the hone keeping my razor in the middle?

My SRP razor from Classic Shaving was fabulously honed by Lynn initially, but I think it now needs another go. What's the betting I manage to undo all his hard work?!

I'm planning to use a 3/3 1/3 1/5 pyramid, stop and check. Does that sound good?

Thanks

Nick

Originally Posted by Manowar

I'm really new to all this, but have bought myself the 3 inch Norton 4k/8k in order to avoid having to master the X pattern, as I figured that it wouldn't be necessary on this wider hone.

Is that right? Can I just go up and down the hone keeping my razor in the middle?

My SRP razor from Classic Shaving was fabulously honed by Lynn initially, but I think it now needs another go. What's the betting I manage to undo all his hard work?!

I'm planning to use a 3/3 1/3 1/5 pyramid, stop and check. Does that sound good?

Thanks

Nick

Check this thread for my view on the X pattern:
http://straightrazorpalace.com/showt...ight=pyramides

cheers,
Nenad