Thread: Shapton Kuromaku 2K... A good alternative to Chosera 1K and Naniwa SS 1K?

I find the 2k is really a non needed stone in a progression that starts at 1k. Spend your money on mid range or a nicer finisher. To be honest I haven’t had a razor on anything less than 8k in 3-4 years, you don’t start at the beginning after the razor is honed, you only need a refresh, and I do that with my 12k Nani. So my opinion waste of money you got a 1k

Originally Posted by CoffeeAddict24

Everyone,

Thanks a lot for your replies. I think I might add either the Kuromaku 2K or 3K to my setup.

Kind regards,
Mike

I'd like to see a link to a 3k Kuromaku. I didn't think they made one

Just had a thought Have you looked at your scratch patterns under magnification ?
I was just thinking your Naniwa 1k might do the job your'e wanting a 2k to do.
Anyone who's never used those 1k Shaptons would swear they're looking at a 600 grit finish, sooooo , if that worked you could then buy a 5k Kuromaku which would bridge to your coticule.

Once I have the bevel set properly, I rely on my combination BBW/coticule and a finisher.

With slurry, the BBW can almost act like a 3k - 4K and the coticule as you dilute the slurry to water acts like a 6K - 8K, so they pretty much cover the middle ground between a 1K bevel setter and a 2k - 4k stria remover.

The trick is that BBWs and coticules are natural stones and no two work the same way, so you have to learn how to max out the stones you own.

My progression with a blade that needs to start over from bevel set is:
1. coarse DMT diamond if I have to reshape the blade and hone out nasty chips (leaves really nasty scratches)
2. 1K diamond plate to dramatically reset the bevel and hone out little chips and dings (leaves nasty scratches)
3. 1K Shapton Kuramaku to set the bevel and start removing scratches
4. BBW slurry => plain water
5. Coticule slurry => plain water
6. a finisher (Vermio, Oozuku or la Lune)

I use to use a Norton 4k/8k, but now feel confident using the BBW and coticule, so it hasn’t come out of the box for a while.

After the finisher, I often use CrOx on balsa to put a final polish on the edge.

I use a 2k in my progression. 1k king, 2k, 5k, 8k 12k Naniwa ss Before I had the 2k I would spend quite a bit of time at the 5k level cleaning up the bevel. I had occasional inconsistency due to not getting all the 1k scratches all the way out of the edge. The 2k makes a nicer transition for me and saved me a little time, my edge consistency is higher too. It’s a lot of stones though.

Most stones aren’t necessary for a good edge. Learning what you have and how to use it is where I would start then fill in the soft places in the progression. That being said, I would look for a 4-5k hone to make the transition to the coticule more appropriate. A Norton 4K/8k isn’t a slouch. Moving from a 8k edge to a coticule will most likely give you a better finished edge more consistently and in far less time. YMMV.

Thank you all for your suggestions.

My usual progression, from factory edge to "shave-ready" (at least, "shave-ready" for me) has been similar to this one:
https://shavelibrary.com/w/A_simple_...e_and_Coticule

I use the Naniwa SS 1K instead of the DMT-E which according to that article in ShaveLibrary is 1200 grit.
After setting the bevel on the Nani 1K (when the razors starts cutting arm hair) I jump to the BBW with slurry then start diluting until it's plain water.

Then, I finish on a Coti with out slurry, no pressure.

But I do that based on that article by Bart (November 30, 2008).

So far, I've been shaping my beard with an Edelweiss that I honed in that fashion. The shaves have been very comfortable with no irritation or nicks. But I've not tried a full shave yet which I believe is the true test. I'll get a full shave maybe in December because I (and my wife) love an almost-full beard.

So, I'm thinking whether any of my BBWs would replace the scratch pattern from the Shapton 1K. As I mention, the BBW and Coti don't leave any rough edge after the Nani, and so far I believe I'm not doing it so bad because shaping my neck area (very sensitive) has been very comfortable.

I think I might try honing the TI that it's on the way to my home, with the Shapton 1K and then jump to BBW with heavy slurry and then diluting. Then, finish on coticule. However, I'm dubious if that will work with the TI (it's an Evide Sonnat) because I've read the still is harder than most German stuff.

Also, I'd like to ask, if I can use the Nani 1K to replace the scratch pattern left by the Shapton 1K, and then jump to BBW with slurry and then Coti? I know YMMV but I don't have a microscope to get a closer look to the bevel. But maybe you guys with more experience can offer some insight if I can do that...

Thanks again for your time helping a honing beginner!!
Kind regards,
Mike

Originally Posted by CoffeeAddict24

Also, I'd like to ask, if I can use the Nani 1K to replace the scratch pattern left by the Shapton 1K, and then jump to BBW with slurry and then Coti? I know YMMV but I don't have a microscope to get a closer look to the bevel. But maybe you guys with more experience can offer some insight if I can do that...

It's hard to give an answer once naturals are involved as they can vary so much.
Just try it. You don't need a microscope. An 8x or 10x loupe will show enough of the scratch pattern for you to decide if it is working.

Originally Posted by onimaru55

It's hard to give an answer once naturals are involved as they can vary so much.
Just try it. You don't need a microscope. An 8x or 10x loupe will show enough of the scratch pattern for you to decide if it is working.

I think I will give a try before getting the 2K.

Thanks a lot!
Kind regards,
Mike

Originally Posted by STF

I have both a Norton 1K and a Naniwa 1K SS.

I was intereted in a Chosera 1K before I bought the Nani but I read up and it seemed that although the Chosera was the bees knees it needed to be used a lot.

The Chosera I read was excellent for someone that hones a lot but for occasional home use can dry out and crack.

I may be wrong, it's just the impresion I got from my reading. Anyway, I got the Naniwa 1K SS and I'm very happy with it.

I also have the 3K - 5K - 8K - 12K SS, I have the Norton 1K - 4K/8K too but love the Nani's because they're just splash and go,no muss no fuss.

The Naniwa 1K Superstone seems to do a good job cleaning up the bevel made with many other faster 1k stones. To me it seems that my 1k Chosera or 1k Norton (yes, I realize that the Norton is ANSI grit and 1k ANSI is a bit coarser) bevel benefits greatly from a few laps on the Nani and makes subsequent stages go faster and cleaner.

I also add a few pull strokes and a few SHORT x strokes at the end of every stage. This does a lot to get rid of the "edge boogers".

Originally Posted by CoffeeAddict24

Everyone,

Thanks a lot for your replies. I think I might add either the Kuromaku 2K or 3K to my setup.

Kind regards,
Mike

Get the 3k. I am probably going to get one, myself. It doesn't load up as badly as the Naniwa SS in that grit. But the 2k isn't bad. I had the loan of one not long ago and I liked it right after the 600 Chosera.

Originally Posted by tcrideshd

I find the 2k is really a non needed stone in a progression that starts at 1k. Spend your money on mid range or a nicer finisher. To be honest I haven’t had a razor on anything less than 8k in 3-4 years, you don’t start at the beginning after the razor is honed, you only need a refresh, and I do that with my 12k Nani. So my opinion waste of money you got a 1k

After the 1k, totally agree. 2k not really doing much. And too many guys go too deep refreshing an edge that the 12k Nani or some 1μ film will touch up just fine.

Now the 2k is nice right after a 600 Kuromaku or Chosera. If I was starting over with what I know now, I wouldn't even buy a 1k. My 320 and 600 are my work horses, and the jump to 2k is very smooth and pleasant and fast. A fast 3k is probably going to be my next purchase, actually. My 3k SS is a PITA some times.