Thread: Please clear this for me, honing ratios

Thank you, i think that this is the kind of reassurance i was looking for. For my first honig i was very afraid thinking that i will ruin the blade, and did some pritty lousy job honing. Tomorow i will tru to do the whole conservative set and see how it goes...

Ha, and the hanging hair test is only a dream for me... I cannot slice a hair from my arm when holding it tight

I was also afraid of doing more damage to my razor (it wouldnt shave arm hair either when i started). On my next honing journy I will be far less delicate, and establish a good bevel first and then work on getting it sharp.
Some guys here have expressed using very coarse (600-1000) grit wet/dry sand paper to establish the correct bevel on really bad razors.. so you do have some room to work with long before you go astray.

If your razor wont shave arm hair I would go with the agressive honing ratio that Randy posted here for you, and just work all the way down to step 4 before I did any testing or stropping... then repeat steps 4&5 over and over untill you get the sharp edge you want..

As David Uthe told me "see its really hard to ruin a razor"

Thanx Kelly,

I just did the agresive honing twice, and i will try to shave tomorrow.

How are you managing to hold the whole edge lenght on the stone? I have the wider version Norton combo, think it was 3", not shure, and i dont have to make an X pattern, but i still have the blade angled a bit.

But the problem for me is to get the whole blade width on the stone, without the edge or the spine separating. So i use my left hand's tree fingers to rest on the spine very lightly. Is this OK? i hope i am not thinning the spine too much...

How are you managing to hold the whole edge lenght on the stone? I have the wider version Norton combo, think it was 3", not shure, and i dont have to make an X pattern, but i still have the blade angled a bit

The norton should be wide enough to lay the razor on the surface even at 90degrees and still have a little room left over? Is your Norton 7.6cm? That would be the 3" model, if it was 5cm then you have the smaller Norton. When I lay the razor on the hone I snug the second stabilizing piece (#2 on the picture from Razor Central/Nasrasur) up next to the edge of the hone. Here is a diagram showing what the stabilizing piece is, its where the actual hollow grind starts:


With this I still have about 2mm of stone extending beyond the point of the razor (my DOVO is a 5/8 round point).

If your having a hard time fitting the blade to the hone you either have the smaller norton or your placing too much of the razor on the hone. You only want the sharp edge of the razor to be on the hone not the stabilizing cut that were formed from the grinding.
From here I gently drag the blade so that the heel slightly leads the point.

But the problem for me is to get the whole blade width on the stone, without the edge or the spine separating.

From what your saying I am visualising you trying to hone like this:


In this image(from classicShaving) the hone is greatly exaggerated and the razor placement and movemen is also exaggerated. You obviously do not want to be rubbing the handles on the hone, but you dont want the tang, or the stabilizing "steps/cuts" to be on the hone either. Just the actual edge from where the "sharp" starts to where the "sharp" ends should be on the hone

Here is another:


This one(from Razor Central/Nassrasur) is a little more close to accurate, but you can see that the image shows the stabilizing cuts as being placed on the hone as well (it actually looks like the blade was placed almost up to the tang)... this would certainly cause part of the blade to come off the hone.

So i use my left hand's tree fingers to rest on the spine very lightly. Is this OK?

I used two hands and pressure when I was honning out nicks in the blade, but the only way I could get the blade sharp enough to cut the hanging hair was to pick up the hone and hold it in one hand while gently dragging the blade with the other hand. I tryed and tryed to get a good edge with the hone on a table and just couldnt do it. I read on the yahoo site where some one had the same issue and found that by holding the hone they had a more gentle touch. So I tryed that and it worked great.
See Message #3088 in the yahoo group for the instructions that i found helpful. If you have a hard time accessing that post let me know and I will paste it here for you, I think it would make a good addition to a "newbies" file for the site.
Another resource that might be of assistance is the Sharpening videos on Nassrasur. I simply cannot sharpen a razor with the method showed in those videos but it does show how he stopps the motion at the stabilizing point. He also uses a 2" stone so it might help you relate a little better the movement and placement of the blade on the hone. Here is a link to the videos on his site(hopefully no one takes offense to me refrencing other sites, I view this as a collective effort :lol: )
Fotos und Videos zur Rasur von Norbert Schick

Kelly! That may just be THE! BEST! response to a newbies question that I have ever seen!!

Well done,

Your too kind ops:


I think that being a newbie my self, and only just recently struggling with some of the same types of issues helps me relate a little. As I find out something new that is working I can pass it along easily because the problem and solution is still very fresh.

I think alot of the people that have been doing this for years have it so down-pat that its more of a reflex for them and they dont have to think about it.. they just "do it" and that can make it hard to articulate.

Hell I may have completly miss-understood the problem and confused poor superfly even more :lol:

Not that this thread isnt alrady long enough :lol: I just found a very cool animated gif that gives a good idea of how to hone a razor


Again, I think they show too much of the heel and stabilizing cuts being placed on the hone.. but this should also give a good idea.

BIG THANX to Kelly, and i agree with Randy, it is one of the best newbie replys Hope i will be better at this after some time and be able to help other straight razor begginers...

I am not confised, but i realize that i have to spend some time (and metal), to go thru the learning curve.

I have the bigger Norton stone, 7.6 cm. I dont have the problem fitting the blade on the stone, it fits perfectly even at 90 degrees, but i hold it at angle (some 75-80), it makes more sence to me.



In your second quote you got me wrong, i said "the whole blade width" not the lenght, but it is OK, since this post is great help anyways

My problem was adressed in your third quote. I have read the #3088 post from yahoo group, and it is also very helpfull.

I will try to hone tomorrow holding the stone in my hand (or lap, since it is quite heavy), and see how it goes. I think it might be the solution for my problem. The same happens when i strop, the blade wiggles (in lack of better description), so i guess it is all in the technique...

This picture will explain my problem better...





Thanks for the link nassrazur, i have seen and browsed the site, but i missed this (most interesting) part

I have the exact blade shown at this link:
http://www.nassrasur.com/norbert/norbert3.html

Ahhhh... I see said the blind man :lol:

So your having trouble just keeping the blade flat on the hone while your going through the motion? I was thinking some strange part of the blade wasnt laying flat with the hone, as if it was warped or maybe you were putting too much of the blade on the hone. Thats why I assumed that you meant length not width (assume= ass-u-me, one sould never assume ops: )

If thats the case my friend, the yes its a matter of technique and pracitce. I have learned that I cannot sharpen a razor with the same technique and reflexes that i have built up sharpening knives. One revelation I expierenced was that i was "gripping" the razor too much.

Well Im glad you got some benifit out of all that :lol:
It sounds like you have the basic ideas together now you just have to turn those ideas into muscle control. I think its more "work" sharpening a razor than a big field knife. I get more tired trying to be gentle than if I were to just hammer the blade back and forth across the hone.

We have a record!
SIX! Yes folks, count them, SIX duplicate posts :lol:

Can I get a seven, do I hear a seven,
six going once....
six going twice........