Thread: Please clear this for me, honing ratios

kELLY, kELLY! YOU DID IT AGAIN! You have no idea how many people have asked about the proper method of honing. No one has EVER! found this gif before. It is dam near perfect.
I have already saved it to my files and I will now try to have this posted in the files & gallery section for all to use as necessary,

A moving picture is worth 100,000 words.

Randy Tuttle

Originally Posted by Kelly

Not that this thread isnt alrady long enough :lol: I just found a very cool animated gif that gives a good idea of how to hone a razor


Again, I think they show too much of the heel and stabilizing cuts being placed on the hone.. but this should also give a good idea.

Kelly, i think I know how i made duplicate posts. I was editing my message a lot (it might been 6 times?), as i was trying to upload my images on the server. I am not shure, but this might be the way to double-post??

What is with the giff? i cannot see it moving, even after saving to desktop?


Ok, back to the gym

Hello Kelly and Superfly,

Well, you guys have really done a good job on this thread. It will benefit many newcomers to our art. I hope that a copy of this thread is posted (without the duplications) in the help files.
The illustrations that you two have incorporated are extremly informative.

Sensi-kyle is working on a pyramid honing guide and I will recommend that he review this thread for inclusion.

Niice work guys,

Randy,

As you say, most barber hones do cut much slower than the Norton. However, do you have an Achorite 2 X 6 combo hone? The coarse side of the Achorite, when used dry, cuts remarkably fast. Even when used with water or lather this hone is quite exceptional.

Hal

Haha... what can I say,
... when you start searching the internet in forgin languages you know you have too much time on your hands. But I am glad to have come across that because it really does simplify the concept of not lifting the razor off the hone. At least that was the value I got out of it.

Originally Posted by randydance062449

kELLY, kELLY! YOU DID IT AGAIN! You have no idea how many people have asked about the proper method of honing. No one has EVER! found this gif before. It is dam near perfect.
I have already saved it to my files and I will now try to have this posted in the files & gallery section for all to use as necessary,

A moving picture is worth 100,000 words.

Randy Tuttle

Dont be so hard on your self superfly,
Even editing your posts should not make them repeat, its a little bug that I think is being worked on now... but it might be good for them to know that it repeated every time you edited the post.. so you might mention it on the Bugs forum.

Originally Posted by superfly

Kelly, i think I know how i made duplicate posts. I was editing my message a lot (it might been 6 times?), as i was trying to upload my images on the server. I am not shure, but this might be the way to double-post??

Originally Posted by superfly

What is with the giff? i cannot see it moving, even after saving to desktop?

Try this link, it might work if you view it out side of the forums:
http://www.messer-machen.de/animgif/rasier.gif

Kelly, you were right, holding the honing stone in your hand gives much better control on the honing process. I have honed the razor once again, but still not sharp. i shaved a couple of inches, and finished the shave with shavette and M3. Maybe tomorrow...

Can you shave with overhoned razor? Maybe i have gone too far (wich i dont believe).

Kelly, the gif wont move , but i made some 3D animation and put it in the superfly gallery. I send it to Dave, i hope he would put it in the files section...

Originally Posted by superfly

Kelly, you were right, holding the honing stone in your hand gives much better control on the honing process.

Yea it's funny how some of the smallest things can make the biggest differences. Glad that helped a little.

Originally Posted by superfly

I have honed the razor once again, but still not sharp. i shaved a couple of inches, and finished the shave with shavette and M3. Maybe tomorrow...

Did you remember to strop before the shave this time? Also, maybe your still using too much presure. Think of the hone as being a peach, and you want to shave the fuzz off the peach But you dont want to cut into the peach.. its avery gentle stroke.

Originally Posted by superfly

Can you shave with overhoned razor? Maybe i have gone too far (wich i dont believe).

You sure can shave with an over honed razor, but your face will hate you for it. I believe I had that problem once, because after a shave my entire face burned. If you feel that might be a problem then treat the razor as if it was... back hone a little and the give a few more passes the correct direction and see how it feels. Dont be afraid to expierement. You can check the Yahoo group for a thread called "Wire Edge Woe's" that starts on message #49206 that gives some great information on back-honing. Also message #50150 is where I've expressed my expierence with what I thought might have been an over honed razor. The back honing helped me out of a jam that I couldnt identify or correct any other way so It must have been an over honing issue.
The Classic Shaving Site has a pretty good description of how to correct an over honed razor also

Originally Posted by classic shaving:

Correcting an over-honed razor
To eliminate an over-honed edge, draw the razor backward in a diagonal line across the hone, using the same moveÂment and pressure as in regular honing. One or two strokes each way will usually remove the rough edge and eliminating any progress made toward sharpening. This is called back honing. The razor is then honed again, starting from the beginning of the process, being careful to prevent over-honing a second time.
Honing and Stropping
The Beginning of the Edge
June 22, 2003

Originally Posted by superfly

Kelly, the gif wont move , but i made some 3D animation and put it in the superfly gallery. I send it to Dave, i hope he would put it in the files section...

I've tryed to view your gallery and it's password protected :lol: But I would love to see your 3D work. If it's as good as your banner creating skills Im sure it will be excellent!

Thanx Kelly, i hope Dave will put the file into Files section...

Honed again... I will shave tomorow. This time i honed holding the razor between my left and my right arm, with hone lying on the table, like on the link from nassrasur you send me. I put a little more presure on it, since on the video there was muddy slury on the hone, but my hone is pure white, no colored slury. On the yelow side there are some black marks apearing...

I strop this time, 50 strokes, and I am improving my stroping technique.

The #50150 was your answer to my post, again

I will check the other post, and the answers and see how it goes.

I just dont wanna mess my beautiful DOVO No.105

Hello Hal,

No, I do not have an achorite. I do have a couple of other combo hone's and several different grits of just "coarse" hones and several different grits of "finishing" hones. My suggestions to guys with a classic hone is based on the assumption of a combo hone where the "coarse side" is no where near the coarseness of a "Little Devil" or a "Carborundum Razor Hone 106". The coarse side of a combo hone is to me a Medum grit hone. I think of the combo hones as equivalent to either a 3000/6000 grit or in some cases a 4000/8000 grit. Some of the single grit finishing hones feel like a 6000 grit and some like a 8000. Some of the single grit coarse stones feel like a 600 - 1000 grit.

In my limited experience it has taken at least 5X the strokes on a classic hone to get the same rate of change as I do with a Norton or a Belgian or sandpaper. The sandpaper is the fastest cutting of any of them. Probably because of the higher density of abrasive particles and the type of abrasive particles used.

The major difficulties are determining the state of the razor's edge, the steel of the razor and the actual grits used in the specific hone. The suggestions I put out here are simply starting points. They are NOT! the final word. People need a structured approach to honing. Without a structure to follow they, like me, tend to go off willy nilly trying this and that to get the razor shaving sharp. The Pyramid method that Lynn put together is a conservative approach to honing a razor. The sequences that I put out there should be adjusted by the user to suit their specific hone's and razor. I tried to put together two general sequences that anyone can start with. I will never have the perfect answer for a person but I can give them a road map to help them get started.

Originally Posted by halwilson

Randy,

As you say, most barber hones do cut much slower than the Norton. However, do you have an Achorite 2 X 6 combo hone? The coarse side of the Achorite, when used dry, cuts remarkably fast. Even when used with water or lather this hone is quite exceptional.

Hal